[Theory] The Shinigami of the Shiki Fūjin

[~Puppet Master~]

Tobi was pretending to be Madara at that time, so the veracity of his comparison is put into question

Not only that but he made a number of wrong assumptions already like this:

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Obviously he was mistaken.

That does make sense, you are right after all =D

 

[Rainbow Dash]

Fun to read.

 

[The Big Boss]

the Hannya Mask was also in the manga/anime rurouni kenshin

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[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

the Hannya Mask was also in the manga/anime rurouni kenshin

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I see, nice to know Lol

 

[veggetta13]

nice thread but we all know the naruto derives from japanese folklore so everything you just said it true if you beliEve in japanese folklore

your comment is pointless.

Nobody is to become a practicer of anything by reading a manga, it is true in cultural knowledge, relevant to the Naruto manga.

It´s not about believing, it´s about knowing, or being informed. You (probably) and I (surely) were informed.






Nice job Thread mAKER

 

[BenjerminGaye]

....I don't care..I like it

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

your comment is pointless.

Nobody is to become a practicer of anything by reading a manga, it is true in cultural knowledge, relevant to the Naruto manga.

It´s not about believing, it´s about knowing, or being informed. You (probably) and I (surely) were informed.






Nice job Thread mAKER

Thank you sir.

 

[Mr Hiru]

Another cool relationship. If this is true, then Kishimoto did his homework pretty well.

 

[Honord Sage]

Opening of Japanese Mythology, Native Shinto religion and its Pantheon of gods mets Buda and the Pantheon of Hindu gods and they blend to each other the Mask act as the connection of gods and demons to humans. We can't touch the gods but the mask by touch acts as the in between for us.

 

[Penguin]

Ahh ok, so Senju + Uchiha = Uzumaki then?

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Ahh ok, so Senju + Uchiha = Uzumaki then?

Not exactly, Uzumaki+ Juubi = Senju and Uchiha

 

[GreenTeaChloe]

Veeeerrrrry interesting :3

 

[saw2097]

You did your research, as did Kishi, a very interesting read.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Veeeerrrrry interesting :3

Thank you

You did your research, as did Kishi, a very interesting read.

Thank you.

 

[Horus]

Interesting stuff. I have read a little on the Japa Mala.
Kudos on gathering the information.

 

[Mikoto]

Sir Dirp, first I just want to say, I really appreciate all of the work you've put into your theories thus far. I've read all of your threads and found them informative and insightful. I'm sending out a memo to one of my cabinet members (and or lowly intern) to rep you.

I'd like to add some ancillary evidence in support of SO6P's Uzumaki lineage. One conceptual problem people seem to be having with the theory, is the (understandable) idea that Naruto is symbolic of the Senju and inevitably will have repeat the Senju and Uchiha curse of hate with Sasuke. I've found some information/ancillary evidence that might help some people get over this hurdle.

1.) Kishimoto changed his plans with Naruto halfway through. In this

You must be registered for see links

, Kishimoto explains how becoming a parent changed him and changed his expectations for the story arc in Naruto.

During my career as a mangaka, I got married, had kids and became a father. This directly influenced the story in Naruto. Through these experiences, I realized the things that are important in this world. Being a parent gave me a different perspective, which I didn’t have when I was single.

The character Naruto represents a little bit of myself and a little bit of my child. It was after my children were born that I wanted to write about Naruto’s parents. The way Naruto’s parents feel about him is very close to how I feel towards my kids.

But I don’t want to get too preachy because manga must always be entertaining. It has to be told from the kid’s point of view. Even if I died someday, I want to leave a work in the world that would let my kids understand what I always wanted to tell them.

This implies that originally, Kishimoto had no intentions for Naruto to meet his parents before Kishimoto himself became one. In other words the themes in Naruto have evolved as Kishimoto himself evolved. Kishimoto is evolving his story organically. He's stated in several interviews that he has only planned out a few things in Naruto ahead of time. I think we can infer that Kishimoto likes to have the freedom to change the plot overtime as he sees fit.

2.) Looking at part 1 of Naruto before the time-skip, Naruto as a character was set up for a much different trajectory as a character. From that point we could all easily have imagined Naruto and Sasuke becoming more and more powerful until they fight ending with Naruto becoming Hokage. At that time I think that sums up most of the expectations of readers before the start of part 2, but that's not what we have seen.

What we have seen is that Naruto's roll has gradually expanded far beyond what we were lead to believe in part 1. Part 1 Naruto is hinted strongly as being the son of Yondaime Hokage. He's is trained and we know will continue to be trained by the same teacher as Minato. All that was established at that time, was naruto's pedigree for becoming Hokage, seemingly meeting the qualifications that the Lords need for one to be considered for Hokage. He at least will meet the prerequisites.

You must be registered for see images

F1. In the last panel at bottom we see the Fire Lord discussing the educational pedigree of Kakashi.

However, there was no talk of "chosen one," no talk of the curse of hate, no talk of stopping the cycle of hatred in the Shinobi system, or any of the major themes in Naruto's character development that would forthcome in part 2 of Naruto. In part 2 Naruto starts walking a path very similar to Jiraiya. And when one steps back and looks at the character development of Naruto thus far we see many parallels to the life of Siddhartha, the man known as Gautama Buddha, who is the originator of Buddhism.

Siddhartha was the son of a King, Naruto is the son of Yondaime Hokage (not a king but close enough). Siddhartha was lecherous in his early life before becoming a sage. Naruto was self-hating. They both had moral weaknesses. Siddhartha was confronted with a question, "how can one be happy with all this suffering around me?" Naruto is confronted with the question, "how do we attain peace, when hatred exists?" Siddhartha fails repeatedly to find the answer but never quits. Obviously Naruto never quits. Siddhartha eventually finds the path to enlightenment through meditation at the tree of life. Naruto's training has involved many periods of meditation. When Siddhartha was deep in meditation, after coming to understand the nature of suffering or "Dukkha," a manifestation of his dark self, Mara, appears representing his attachments to this world. Siddhartha defeats Mara by surrendering, attaining nirvana, then becoming Buddha. Naruto meditates at the falls of truth and defeats his dark self in much the same way, surpassing his hatred.

What's my point? This is not the character arc of a simple protagonist. This is the arc of a sage, someone who walks a rare path that results in illumination and enlightenment. Naruto's arc is no longer a simple struggle with a friend. It's a much broader struggle that ecompases these esscential truths of existance. The themes in part 2 are far more complex and broader than simple friendship/rivalry. Naruto no longer cares about beating Sasuke as a rival. And unlike Sasuke, has transcended his selfishness to solve those larger goals. Sasuke has struggled with resentment and hate, but more often than not succumbed to it, and certainly has yet to transcend. While Naruto has let go of his earthly attachments, for the most part, in search of the answer to peace. The answer to which seems to be self-sacrifice and not military might.

If we use the hero's journey to make some further predictions with regards to Naruto's character arch, we can say that naruto is in the process of transmitting what he's learned on his journey to the broader world. This sums up the ending of the hero's journey as outlined by Campbell. This is similar to Gautama Buddha transmitting the dharma to those around him. In the latest chapters of Naruto we can see this as a growing theme between Sasuke, Naruto, and Itachi. Itachi's admonition to Naruto has changed Naruto's relationship/responsibility to Sasuke from rival to teacher or caretaker. Naruto will now help Sasuke to find the right path, the path that transcends hate.

Although they may fight, Naruto no longer embodies the Senju, but has transcended to that of the Sage of the Six Paths or a Buddha. One who shows the way. Although Sasuke seems to be projecting that Senju role onto Naruto, and is still within the cycle of hate, Naruto is currently outside of it. Ironic that Sasuke has repeatedly accused Naruto of being just that, an outsider.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Sir Dirp, first I just want to say, I really appreciate all of the work you've put into your theories thus far. I've read all of your threads and found them informative and insightful. I'm sending out a memo to one of my cabinet members (and or lowly intern) to rep you.

I'd like to add some ancillary evidence in support of SO6P's Uzumaki lineage. One conceptual problem people seem to be having with the theory, is the (understandable) idea that Naruto is symbolic of the Senju and inevitably will have repeat the Senju and Uchiha curse of hate with Sasuke. I've found some information/ancillary evidence that might help some people get over this hurdle.

1.) Kishimoto changed his plans with Naruto halfway through. In this

You must be registered for see links

, Kishimoto explains how becoming a parent changed him and changed his expectations for the story arc in Naruto.



This implies that originally, Kishimoto had no intentions for Naruto to meet his parents before Kishimoto himself became one. In other words the themes in Naruto have evolved as Kishimoto himself evolved. Kishimoto is evolving his story organically. He's stated in several interviews that he has only planned out a few things in Naruto ahead of time. I think we can infer that Kishimoto likes to have the freedom to change the plot overtime as he sees fit.

2.) Looking at part 1 of Naruto before the time-skip, Naruto as a character was set up for a much different trajectory as a character. From that point we could all easily have imagined Naruto and Sasuke becoming more and more powerful until they fight ending with Naruto becoming Hokage. At that time I think that sums up most of the expectations of readers before the start of part 2, but that's not what we have seen.

What we have seen is that Naruto's roll has gradually expanded far beyond what we were lead to believe in part 1. Part 1 Naruto is hinted strongly as being the son of Yondaime Hokage. He's is trained and we know will continue to be trained by the same teacher as Minato. All that was established at that time, was naruto's pedigree for becoming Hokage, seemingly meeting the qualifications that the Lords need for one to be considered for Hokage. He at least will meet the prerequisites.

You must be registered for see images

F1. In the last panel at bottom we see the Fire Lord's advisors discussing the educational pedigree of Kakashi.

However, there was no talk of "chosen one," no talk of the curse of hate, no talk of stopping the cycle of hatred in the Shinobi system, or any of the major themes in Naruto's character development that would forthcome in part 2 of Naruto. In part 2 Naruto starts walking a path very similar to Jiraiya. And when one steps back and looks at the character development of Naruto thus far we see many parallels to the life of Siddhartha, the man known as Gautama Buddha, who is the originator of Buddhism.

Siddhartha was the son of a King, Naruto is the son of Yondaime Hokage (not a king but close enough). Siddhartha was lecherous in his early life before becoming a sage. Naruto was self-hating. They both had moral weaknesses. Siddhartha was confronted with a question, "how can one be happy with all this suffering around me?" Naruto is confronted with the question, "how do we attain peace, when hatred exists?" Siddhartha fails repeatedly to find the answer but never quits. Obviously Naruto never quits. Siddhartha eventually finds the path to enlightenment through meditation at the tree of life. Naruto's training has involved many periods of meditation. When Siddhartha was deep in meditation, after coming to understand the nature of suffering or "Dukkha," a manifestation of his dark self, Mara, appears representing his attachments to this world. Siddhartha defeats Mara by surrendering, attaining nirvana, then becoming Buddha. Naruto meditates at the falls of truth and defeats his dark self in much the same way, surpassing his hatred.

What's my point? This is not the character arc of a simple protagonist. This is the arc of a sage, someone who walks a rare path that results in illumination and enlightenment. Naruto's arc is no longer a simple struggle with a friend. It's a much broader struggle that ecompases these esscential truths of existance. The themes in part 2 are far more complex and broader than simple friendship/rivalry. Naruto no longer cares about beating Sasuke as a rival. And unlike Sasuke, has transcended his selfishness to solve those larger goals. Sasuke has struggled with resentment and hate, but more often than not succumbed to it, and certainly has yet to transcend. While Naruto has let go of his earthly attachments, for the most part, in search of the answer to peace. The answer to which seems to be self-sacrifice and not military might.

If we use the hero's journey to make some further predictions with regards to Naruto's character arch, we can say that naruto is in the process of transmitting what he's learned on his journey to the broader world. This sums up the ending of the hero's journey as outlined by Campbell. This is similar to Gautama Buddha transmitting the dharma to those around him. In the latest chapters of Naruto we can see this as a growing theme between Sasuke, Naruto, and Itachi. Itachi's admonition to Naruto has changed Naruto's relationship/responsibility to Sasuke from rival to teacher or caretaker. Naruto will now help Sasuke to find the right path, the path that transcends hate.

Although they may fight, Naruto no longer embodies the Senju, but has transcended to that of the Sage of the Six Paths or a Buddha. One who shows the way. Although Sasuke seems to be projecting that Senju role onto Naruto, and is still within the cycle of hate, Naruto is currently outside of it. Ironic that Sasuke has repeatedly accused Naruto of being just that, an outsider.

Wow o_o , this is really good, I have to spread rep. first but those are really good points

And you are right that Kishimoto gradually changed the theme and trajectory of the story midway in writing Naruto.

 

[Ψ Veritas Ψ]

Good work as always dirp

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Good work as always dirp

Thanks Doc =D

 

[Transcendence]

That is an amazing reply... Damn. I comply with that mans reply in its entirety. Kishimoto clearly stemmed away from the Elder-Younger hostility parallel when it was revealed Naruto was the "Child of Prophecy". Further a testament to that is when the Bijuu's acknowledged him. His real parallel (Besides the obvious Opposite Naruto in Obito) is Rikudou. His ideals mirror Rikudou's.