Current Kakashi vs Kisame Hoshigoki

[Wave.]

Or he could like use Raikiri on the water and make Kisame die of a heart attack.

Or sharingan genjutsu.

Wouldn't Kakashi also get affected if he was on the water?

Samehada can break him out of it.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Basic nature pokemon logic: Raton > Suiton.Kakashi also fights with Kage Bunshins, he was able to fool Pein a rinnegan user for half of the fight thus giving him enough time to analyze his opponent.Kakashi can copy most of Kisame water jutsu's as well as using lightning base moves to keep Kisame at bay.If Kamui wasn't restricted then it would be a more fair fight.

Lol bro, Kisame defeats Kakashi without Kamui quite comfortably. Raiton doesn't trump Suiton in Naruto, number one. Plus, even if Kakashi uses his raiton techniques on water, it will only do him harm. As A) he's wasting chakra, B) He'll take damage himself, and C) Samehada will simply absorb it. What will Kakashi's Kage Bunshins accomplish when Kisame can easily create a number of sharks that outnumber Kakashi's bunshins by a large margin. Not to mention, Kisame has Mizu Bunshins himself, which hold 1/10 of the originals chakra. Keep in mind 30% is more then enough to create giant lakes.

Kakashi copying Kisames moves will only further his chakra depletion. He in no way, is able to compete with Kisame here. Raikiri and whatever raiton variants Kakashi uses, is simply absorbed by Samehada.

No way near a close fight.

Kisame.. Can counter Kamui..


Kisame CAN Counter Kamui



What is Kamui first of all? Kamui is CHAKRA focused from the users Sharingan deployed to which bends time itself; transports the users target into a different dimension at the use/suspense of CHAKRA. The key word in this is chakra, why exactly? Isn't it obvious? Every jutsu that can be absorbed is related to chakra somehow, and this is one of those occasions.

Some may be iffy to except such a fact, but since Kamui is chakra itself it can, and it will be absorbed by Samehada.

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The databook itself states that no JUTSU can counter Kamui, however Samehada isn't a jutsu it's a legendary weapon with the power to absorb chakra.. It also states that Kamui requires chakra to use, thus I believe this is how chakra is deployed within the Sharingan.

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As seen in the scan above, a user has chakra points in their head (eyes) thus' the chakra builds up when using Kamui directing strain (cause of unavoidable blindness overtime) then deploys the techniques at the user, no matter how fast Kamui may seem to be Samehada is able to absorb the said attack due to it's large size (more range to absorb) etc..

However, I don't think Kakashi would make it out of Kisame's Water Shark Prison Jutsu.

Exactly this. Only problem is, Kisame has no knowledge on Kamui and most likely won't be able to react fast enough as he wouldn't be able to foresee it coming.

With full knowledge on Kamui, Kisame wins. Without prior knowledge, Kakashi wins IMO.

 

[Zexion~]

Or he could like use Raikiri on the water and make Kisame die of a heart attack.

Or sharingan genjutsu.

Or he merges with Samehada .. and then absorbs all the raiton that comes around him .. meaning no damage.

and please if Kamui is not going to work his pathetic Genjutsu wont either

 

[DrProof]

Lol bro, Kisame defeats Kakashi without Kamui quite comfortably. Raiton doesn't trump Suiton in Naruto, number one. Plus, even if Kakashi uses his raiton techniques on water, it will only do him harm. As A) he's wasting chakra, B) He'll take damage himself, and C) Samehada will simply absorb it. What will Kakashi's Kage Bunshins accomplish when Kisame can easily create a number of sharks that outnumber Kakashi's bunshins by a large margin. Not to mention, Kisame has Mizu Bunshins himself, which hold 1/10 of the originals chakra. Keep in mind 30% is more then enough to create giant lakes.

Kakashi copying Kisames moves will only further his chakra depletion. He in no way, is able to compete with Kisame here. Raikiri and whatever raiton variants Kakashi uses, is simply absorbed by Samehada.

No way near a close fight.



Exactly this. Only problem is, Kisame has no knowledge on Kamui and most likely won't be able to react fast enough as he wouldn't be able to foresee it coming.

With full knowledge on Kamui, Kisame wins. Without prior knowledge, Kakashi wins IMO.

Kamui is defeated within this thread:

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[Optimistic]

Lol bro, Kisame defeats Kakashi without Kamui quite comfortably. Raiton doesn't trump Suiton in Naruto, number one. Plus, even if Kakashi uses his raiton techniques on water, it will only do him harm. As A) he's wasting chakra, B) He'll take damage himself, and C) Samehada will simply absorb it. What will Kakashi's Kage Bunshins accomplish when Kisame can easily create a number of sharks that outnumber Kakashi's bunshins by a large margin. Not to mention, Kisame has Mizu Bunshins himself, which hold 1/10 of the originals chakra. Keep in mind 30% is more then enough to create giant lakes.

Kakashi copying Kisames moves will only further his chakra depletion. He in no way, is able to compete with Kisame here. Raikiri and whatever raiton variants Kakashi uses, is simply absorbed by Samehada.

No way near a close fight.

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[TheEvilOne]

You don't get it, do you? Kisame was surprised Kakashi was capable

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. I'm not talking about tsukuyomi here at all. Itachi himself stated a fight between

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. And while they were talking about part2 Kakashi, at that point, Kakashi had no mastery over his kamui that made him go to hospital after one or 2use of it, so it had nothing to do with his overall level that they were talking about(most of them didn't even know he had kamui at that point). You are simply underestimating Kakashi here as always. Base Kakashi is stronger than Tsunade for example. In the contrary of other MS users, his general arsenal is too much that he doesn't need to rely on kamui too much like Obito for example

No, you don't see my point. Itachi simply spared Kakashi's life. Kisame praised him means nothing. He didn't said 'wow, he can defeat Itachi'. He just marked that Kakashi is not that bad.

If you really believe Kakashi can defeat Tsunade without Kamui, slap yourself.

Kakashi without Kamui is above Zabuza's level as Kakashi has gotten way stronger than before he was able to defeat the Asura Path with some help, his clone was fighting two pains, he held his own against edo jins and managed to defeat Obito in the Kamui diemension.

Yeah, he is above Zabuza's level. Wait... only his dogs are above his level, because they defeated him and not Kakashi

He managed to defeat an exhausted Obito. Kakashi's chakra was replenished by Sakura and Naruto too.


OT: It's funny how Bogard stopped posting after Proof proved Kisame can counter the Kamui :yeah:

 

[pateuvasiliu]

OT: It's funny how Bogard stopped posting after Proof proved Kisame can counter the Kamui

Proof didn't prove anything.

What he has is speculation.

The best absorbing feat of Samehada is V2 Bee's lariat, which is nowhere near as fast and concentrated as Kamui.

What's worse is he thinks Kisame can even react to Kamui, when his reflexes have been shown to be nothing compared to something as fast as Ay.

Furthermore, reacting to Kamui is harder than reacting to Ay's shunshin - which Kisame could not do.. That jutsu took out susanoo arrows, nails and even hit BM Naruto to the point where Obito was unaware it even occured.

Kisame absorbing Kamui is pure fan fiction.

 

[Zexion~]

Proof didn't prove anything.

What he has is speculation.

The best absorbing feat of Samehada is V2 Bee's lariat, which is nowhere near as fast and concentrated as Kamui.

What's worse is he thinks Kisame can even react to Kamui, when his reflexes have been shown to be nothing compared to something as fast as Ay.

Furthermore, Ay is slower than Kamui's speed. That jutsu took out susanoo arrows, nails and even hit BM Naruto to the point where Obito was unaware it even occured.

Kisame absorbing Kamui is pure fan fiction.

Kakashi still has to charge his chakra .. Samehada can sense the chakra building up into his eyes.. Kisame is not an idiot he knows what that means ..especially being partnered with itachi

 

[pateuvasiliu]

Kakashi still has to charge his chakra .. Samehada can sense the chakra building up into his eyes.. Kisame is not an idiot he knows what that means ..especially being partnered with itachi

Charge his chakra?

When did he have time to do it against Sasuke's Susanoo? HE decided the arrows was too fast midway through its flight. His kamui took out an object larger than Kisame ( way larger ) and -FASTER- than Kisame in a few miliseconds.

No amount of Itachi partnership will help Kisame here. Not only is Kamui faster than Itachi's Amaterasu, he has no intel on it.

 

[Zexion~]

Charge his chakra?

When did he have time to do it against Sasuke's Susanoo? HE decided the arrows was too fast midway through its flight. His kamui took out an object larger than Kisame ( way larger ) and -FASTER- than Kisame in a few miliseconds.

No amount of Itachi partnership will help Kisame here. Not only is Kamui faster than Itachi's Amaterasu, he has no intel on it.

Idk he most likely did it before hand .. he was shown to do it in the Rescue kazekage arc .. and i mean it never really showed him training,or even implied that he had so i dont see how he could of improved it at all, and this would mean Kisame would have more time to use his suitons.. although he usually does at the beginning of every fight anyway .. meanwhile Kakashi never has started off with Kamui .. not even when he knew he was going up against the leader of the akatsuki ..

 

[DrProof]

Proof didn't prove anything.

What he has is speculation.

The best absorbing feat of Samehada is V2 Bee's lariat, which is nowhere near as fast and concentrated as Kamui.

What's worse is he thinks Kisame can even react to Kamui, when his reflexes have been shown to be nothing compared to something as fast as Ay.

Furthermore, reacting to Kamui is harder than reacting to Ay's shunshin - which Kisame could not do.. That jutsu took out susanoo arrows, nails and even hit BM Naruto to the point where Obito was unaware it even occured.

Kisame absorbing Kamui is pure fan fiction.

You do realize that Ay, and Bee didn't battle Kisame, but Zetsu

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This theory says hi:

I'll make this a complex theory in which many can understand. I just can't stand this Kamui > All talk, so I'm here to prove it all wrong.

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The Sharingan (in which enables the user to use Kamui) is located within the head, in which the two eye sockets have their own tenketsu (chakra points):

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Kamui is then conjured by the Mangekyou Sharingan, meaning that chakra is implemented (causing the wrinkle; distortion in time/space), meaning that it's a jutsu (chakra is ultimately implemented):

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The chakra in which Kamui contains is used to warp the targeted object, in which is contained in the formed wrinkle/ripple:

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Some may argue that Kamui is to fast, while I disagree. Remember Sasori's Satetsu (Iron Sand) was fast enough to break the sound barrier:

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And what exactly was the counter to its speed? Stationary Tactics:

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In which two specific entities can achieve; Gakido The Preta Path:

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And Samehada:

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Hiraishin no Jutsu is quite different. Hiraishin no Jutsu simply transports the user to a tagged kunai at instantaneous speed, while Kamui is chakra focused to a certain viewpoint, and targeted object. The chakra is used to create a wrinkle/ripple in time/space, then the chakra is dispersed to transport the object into another dimension closing the wrinkle/ripple.

Also do not take what the Databook says directly, most of the techniques in which the Databook goes in depth on, are hyped beyond measure eg; Amaterasu is as hot as the sun. If that was the case Obito would have been dead on contact, along with Yondaime Raikage, and The Samurai who came in contact with Amaterasu.

So remember everyone:

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[Totsuka gg Amaterasu gg]

You do realize that Ay, and Bee didn't battle Kisame, but Zetsu

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This theory says hi:

I think you're smarter than Kishi
you should be the one to write Naruto imo
at least Sasuke Hashirama Naruto and Madara wouldn't be the only 4 people in the manga who could effectively use their abilities / full potential

 

[DrProof]

I think you're smarter than Kishi
you should be the one to write Naruto imo
at least Sasuke Hashirama Naruto and Madara wouldn't be the only 4 people in the manga who could effectively use their abilities / full potential

If I wrote Naruto every shinobi would utilize their full potential, along with the fact I wouldn't leave a shit load of plotholes void. :yeah:

 

[TheEvilOne]

I think you're smarter than Kishi
you should be the one to write Naruto imo
at least Sasuke Hashirama Naruto and Madara wouldn't be the only 4 people in the manga who could effectively use their abilities / full potential

If he would be Kishi, Kakuzu would be the Rikodu Sennin.

 

[DrProof]

If he would be Kishi, Kakuzu would be the Rikodu Sennin.

Plausible indeed.

 

[Totsuka gg Amaterasu gg]

If I wrote Naruto every shinobi would utilize their full potential, along with the fact I wouldn't leave a shit load of plotholes void. :yeah:

exactly what I think

If he would be Kishi, Kakuzu would be the Rikodu Sennin.

at least a dude with about 100 years of fighting experience, who shitstomped Kakashi one of the best analyzers / strategists in the entire manga, wouldn't get defeated by a basic shadow clone trick U_U

 

[DrProof]

exactly what I think


at least a dude with about 100 years of fighting experience, who shitstomped Kakashi one of the best analyzers / strategists in the entire manga, wouldn't get defeated by a basic shadow clone trick U_U

This, this, and this!

 

[DemonicAvenger]

Dr. Proof, I have one concern about your theory. How can you be certain the chakra wasn't drained away in creating the ripple instead of the chakra being present in the ripple?

 

[Bogard]

OT: It's funny how Bogard stopped posting after Proof proved Kisame can counter the Kamui :yeah:

Or simply i wasn't online/didn't have time to post/simply forgot to post til then? I don't sleep on internet to stay and wait for replies. I don't check one page only even when i'm on internet. Or your lack of brain is that much that such a simple thought like this never crossed your mind? Last time i posted, i just realised Proof posted as well, but i went off-line because i had something else to do, when i came back i simply forgot, but well i don't even know why i even try to justify myself on internet when someone is that close minded

 

[Izuna Kakashi Senju]

No, you don't see my point. Itachi simply spared Kakashi's life. Kisame praised him means nothing. He didn't said 'wow, he can defeat Itachi'. He just marked that Kakashi is not that bad.

If you really believe Kakashi can defeat Tsunade without Kamui, slap yourself.



Yeah, he is above Zabuza's level. Wait... only his dogs are above his level, because they defeated him and not Kakashi

He managed to defeat an exhausted Obito. Kakashi's chakra was replenished by Sakura and Naruto too.


OT: It's funny how Bogard stopped posting after Proof proved Kisame can counter the Kamui :yeah:

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Yeah Kakashi never defeated him.