Sasuke vs Minato

[pateuvasiliu]

So why didn't Kurama get crushed when Madara used Susano'o to cover him then, h mmm?

Because Madara molded the Susanoo around Kurama whereas Sasuke summoning a hawk while covered in Susanoo forcibly puts the hawk inside Susanoo.

 

[ItachiStillSolos]

Minato could just put barriers, which could counter/redirect any attacks Sasuke could try back to him. He didn't do it against the Juubi because it would have killed everyone on the battlefield at the same time and most probably uselessly(we've seen Juubi capable to survive his own TBB). But Sasuke doesn't possess attacks of such scale. Arrows, Magatamas would only guide Sasuke to his own death.

With minato's speed, he has absolute no way to touch him, let alone follow him. It's already proven he can't even follow Raikage in V2 who is slower than Minato, and less skilfull than him. Like Kabuto was also dominating him easily if not Itachi, Kabuto who has not shown particular destructive powers as well.

Infact, Minato's arsenal counters Sasuke pretty easily. S/T barrier or hiraishin counters everything Sasuke has back to him, or simply avoid it if he really feels the need. With markings, everywhere he could even surprise Sasuke at anytime from unknown position if he doesn't pay enough attention. His quickness in thinking during battles is also far ahead of Sasuke, so the time, Sasuke would be thinking one thing, Minato would already be a step ahead

In latest chapters, we have seen Minato capable to redirect the most powerful attack we've seen in the manga so far in the sea by leaving one of his markings near a rock placed on the middle of ocean without even touching it thanks to his S/T barrier and near instantly

Spoiler

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So what if Minato has placed/places one of his kunais near a volcano and warps Sasuke(with or without his Susanoo) inside the volcano? It's GG. He would be desintagrated in an instant, and even if by some miracle smh he survives(jk), in the middle of a volcano, he couldn't surely live

We've seen in this chapter that Minato is even capable to warp different entities(including himself) at different locations without touching them, if they stay on the range of his jutsu(even if you believe he needs to touch them it's irrelevant for my arguments anyway):

Spoiler

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We also know thanks to Gaara that Susanoo is a different entity than the user since the user can be seperated from it

Spoiler

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That's why i think that Minato with his FTG can seperate the Susanoo user(Sasuke in this case) from his Susanoo since he has shown the capacity to warp different entities in different locations at the same time.

In this chapter anyway, once again, Minato talked about

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. So all Minato wanted was for them to be before him. For what reason? To be in range of the jutsu obviously, and curiously it's in a similar way like Genma's squad did with Mei

Spoiler

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So it's more than obvious that FTG has a range, and needs no contact whatsover within that certain range

Reason why i believe that with this FTG ability, he should be capable to warp Susanoo and his user to different locations(or just one of them depending on his intentions)

Before saying that Susanoo could instantly be created once again(for those who believe so), i'll like to point out something. It's been shown in this manga that for the creation of Susanoo, there is a chakra manifestation before

Spoiler

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And when Susanoo is created, it has been shown that the Susanoo user can't create another one. It's for that reason that Madara had no other choice than using Rinnengan's Gakidou ability to warp the attack

Spoiler

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To recreate Susanoo, he needs

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Something that was again proven when Hashirama

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. He couldn't activate it once more at that time

It's because of this that warping the Susanoo user out of his Susanoo will leave him open since at that moment(the time to deactivate the jutsu and reactivate it), he couldn't use Susanoo

Minato needs to be stationary to put barriers, Susano'o arrow/Yasaka Magatama/Amaterasu GG.
Having hiraishins everywhere can be countered with enton spam.

Having kunais in volcanoes is considered prep time

Yes I do think he needs to touch them, so how will Minato warp a Enton covered Susano'o?

 

[pateuvasiliu]

Minato needs to be stationary to put barriers

Says who? It's a jutsu like any other, there is nothing suggesting he needs to be stationary.

Yes I do think he needs to touch them, so how will Minato warp a Enton covered Susano'o?

Since when can Sasuke cover his whole Susanoo in it? Also, who told you that the flames of Amaterasu will not burn through the Susanoo? Sasuke only used Enton on small bits of it, not the whole.

 

[Shura]

Minato could just put barriers, which could counter/redirect any attacks Sasuke could try back to him. He didn't do it against the Juubi because it would have killed everyone on the battlefield at the same time and most probably uselessly(we've seen Juubi capable to survive his own TBB). But Sasuke doesn't possess attacks of such scale. Arrows, Magatamas would only guide Sasuke to his own death.

When Minato uses that S/T Barrier, he has to stand still, meaning that Sasuke can control his Enton to attack him from all sides. Not to mention that Amaterasu is instant so I doubt Minato will have time to pull out a kunai, bring it up and activate the barrier.

With minato's speed, he has absolute no way to touch him, let alone follow him. It's already proven he can't even follow Raikage in V2 who is slower than Minato, and less skilfull than him. Like Kabuto was also dominating him easily if not Itachi, Kabuto who has not shown particular destructive powers as well.

In the latest chapter, Sasuke keeped up with Naruto. U_U

Infact, Minato's arsenal counters Sasuke pretty easily. S/T barrier or hiraishin counters everything Sasuke has back to him, or simply avoid it if he really feels the need. With markings, everywhere he could even surprise Sasuke at anytime from unknown position if he doesn't pay enough attention. His quickness in thinking during battles is also far ahead of Sasuke, so the time, Sasuke would be thinking one thing, Minato would already be a step ahead

Sasuke is a Sharingan user which means that he can predict movements and read minds so no, Minato won't be one step ahead of him.

In latest chapters, we have seen Minato capable to redirect the most powerful attack we've seen in the manga so far in the sea by leaving one of his markings near a rock placed on the middle of ocean without even touching it thanks to his S/T barrier and near instantly

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

So what if Minato has placed/places one of his kunais near a volcano and warps Sasuke(with or without his Susanoo) inside the volcano? It's GG. He would be desintagrated in an instant, and even if by some miracle smh he survives(jk), in the middle of a volcano, he couldn't surely live

He was able to do so because he was an Edo. It took him more time to warp Kurama's TBB when he was alive.
That's assuming Minato can even touch and place a seal on a Enton covered Susano'o.
Where the heck is he supposed to find a volcano?

We've seen in this chapter that Minato is even capable to warp different entities(including himself) at different locations without touching them, if they stay on the range of his jutsu(even if you believe he needs to touch them it's irrelevant for my arguments anyway):

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

We also know thanks to Gaara that Susanoo is a different entity than the user since the user can be seperated from it

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

That's why i think that Minato with his FTG can seperate the Susanoo user(Sasuke in this case) from his Susanoo since he has shown the capacity to warp different entities in different locations at the same time.
In this chapter anyway, once again, Minato talked about

You must be registered for see links

. So all Minato wanted was for them to be before him. For what reason? To be in range of the jutsu obviously, and curiously it's in a similar way like Genma's squad did with Mei

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

So it's more than obvious that FTG has a range, and needs no contact whatsover within that certain range

Reason why i believe that with this FTG ability, he should be capable to warp Susanoo and his user to different locations(or just one of them depending on his intentions)

Before saying that Susanoo could instantly be created once again(for those who believe so), i'll like to point out something. It's been shown in this manga that for the creation of Susanoo, there is a chakra manifestation before

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

And when Susanoo is created, it has been shown that the Susanoo user can't create another one. It's for that reason that Madara had no other choice than using Rinnengan's Gakidou ability to warp the attack

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

To recreate Susanoo, he needs

You must be registered for see links

Something that was again proven when Hashirama

You must be registered for see links

. He couldn't activate it once more at that time

It's because of this that warping the Susanoo user out of his Susanoo will leave him open since at that moment(the time to deactivate the jutsu and reactivate it), he couldn't use Susanoo

He needs a seal near Sasuke and that won't happen since Sasuke can either cover the Susano'o in Enton or counter Minato's Kunai with his own Shurikenjutsu. Not to mention that Sasuke can see the chakra emitting from the seals.

 

[ItachiStillSolos]

Says who? It's a jutsu like any other, there is nothing suggesting he needs to be stationary.



Since when can Sasuke cover his whole Susanoo in it? Also, who told you that the flames of Amaterasu will not burn through the Susanoo? Sasuke only used Enton on small bits of it, not the whole.

He has only done the jutsu when he's stationary, but that might be assumption on my part.

Susano'o didn't get burned when it was covered by it, heck Sasuke didn't get burned when he held it. Nothing to imply it will get burned. Doesn't mean he can't.

 

[Bogard]

Minato needs to be stationary to put barriers, Susano'o arrow/Yasaka Magatama/Amaterasu GG.
Having hiraishins everywhere can be countered with enton spam.

Read again. During the same moment we see him warping Juubi's Bijuudama, we see him throwing a kunai, appearing on it and having a chat. He wasn't stationary at all

Spoiler

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Having kunais in volcanoes is considered prep time

It's Minato's fighting style. Even markings on his kunais are made before hand. If he puts markings on his kunais, why not in volcanoes? If we see him puting markings middle ocean in the manga, why not in volcanoes?

Yes I do think he needs to touch them, so how will Minato warp a Enton covered Susano'o?

S/T barrier needs no contact whatsover and has a huge range like we can see both times when he redirected Kyubi's or Juubi's blast. FTG has a range as well like i've already explained, but even if you don't believe so, S/T barrier will deal with it. He would be warped there in an instant Enton Susanoo or not

 

[pateuvasiliu]

When Minato uses that S/T Barrier, he has to stand still,

Says who?

In the latest chapter, Sasuke keeped up with Naruto.

Stop being dumb, they weren't running at full speed, they were behind Sakura for God's sake.

Sasuke is a Sharingan user which means that he can predict movements and read minds so no, Minato won't be one step ahead of him.

read minds

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He was able to do so because he was an Edo. It took him more time to warp Kurama's TBB when he was alive.

It has been stated the Edos were not brought back at full power.

 

[Shura]

Says who?

The manga.

Stop being dumb, they weren't running at full speed, they were behind Sakura for God's sake.

Sasuke keeped up with Naruto. They were trying to get to the Juubi or Sakura as fast as they could. U_U

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It has been stated the Edos were not brought back at full power.

It took longer to S/T Kurama's TBB than the Juubi's. :|

 

[pateuvasiliu]

The manga.

Nah. Show me proof that he can't use it while moving.

Sasuke keeped up with Naruto. They were trying to get to the Juubi or Sakura as fast as they could.

Don't be ridiculous. Not only were they not sprinting at full speed, they used a ranged attack, completely defeating the purpose of running at max speed.

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Not only is that Part 1 jazz that was never used after ( and if Kakashi could read minds he would have done it against Pain or Kakuzu ), but he was not reading his mind, he was using genjutsu.

Even then, Sasuke never did that.

It took longer to S/T Kurama's TBB than the Juubi's.

He was deciding where to send it? Dunno.

It's mangafact the Edo Hokages are weaker than they were in life.

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[Shura]

Nah. Show me proof that he can't use it while moving.

Show me proof that he can because the only time he was using it, Minato had to stay stationary. U_U

Don't be ridiculous. Not only were they not sprinting at full speed, they used a ranged attack, completely defeating the purpose of running at max speed.

Now you're just trying to deny it.

Not only is that Part 1 jazz that was never used after ( and if Kakashi could read minds he would have done it against Pain or Kakuzu ), but he was not reading his mind, he was using genjutsu.

Even then, Sasuke never did that.

More denial. The abillity is still there. It doesn't matter if you either like it or not. U_U

 

[ItachiStillSolos]

Read again. During the same moment we see him warping Juubi's Bijuudama, we see him throwing a kunai, appearing on it and having a chat. He wasn't stationary at all

Spoiler

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I meant when he is teleporting the bijuudama, he threw the kunai, appeared on it and had a chat after the bijuudama was teleported. Besides using enton Sasuke could attack from all sides.

It's Minato's fighting style. Even markings on his kunais are made before hand. If he puts markings on his kunais, why not in volcanoes? If we see him puting markings middle ocean in the manga, why not in volcanoes?

XD Thank you now I could use that in my other Minato debates, his kunais now are considered prep time. No but seriously, with that logic I can say a good portion of the arena will be covered with enton since he did it before why not now U_U

S/T barrier needs no contact whatsover and has a huge range like we can see both times when he redirected Kyubi's or Juubi's blast. FTG has a range as well like i've already explained, but even if you don't believe so, S/T barrier will deal with it. He would be warped there in an instant Enton Susanoo or not

He redirected it because it was heading towards him. Unless Sasuke is charging to him he can't teleport him, or he needs a marking on Sasuke but that is unlikely with Susano'o and enton.

 

[Bogard]

Just to remind you, Minato's shunshin was so fast that it was capable to leave even the strongest characters like Hashirama or great shunshin users like Tobirama in the dust. Funny thing is that those same Hokages also left Sasuke behind him. Quite the forshadowing explaining the gap in speed that we have between Minato and Sasuke U_U

 

[ItachiStillSolos]

Wait a second Minato can use KCM. Never mind he wins (-_-)

 

[pateuvasiliu]

Show me proof that he can because the only time he was using it, Minato had to stay stationary.

There is nothing to suggest he needs to stand still. You cannot prove it and there is no logic in saying he can't move while using it. As such, your argument is flawed.

Now you're just trying to deny it.

Ridiculous, once more.

As I said, that would imply Sakura is faster than both.

Your logic is terrible.

More denial. The abillity is still there. It doesn't matter if you either like it or not.

Kakashi told Zabuza he could read his mind. It was to demoralise him.

Not that it matters, Sasuke never used that ability and as such it is not a feat he has.

 

[ninthgate]

Except that you can use a jutsu while moving.

He's clearly maintaining a position in relation to the barrier:

Spoiler

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[Bogard]

I meant when he is teleporting the bijuudama, he threw the kunai, appeared on it and had a chat after the bijuudama was teleported. Besides using enton Sasuke could attack from all sides.

We see in the next chapter that the Bijuudama wasn't redirected at all already:

Spoiler

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So he did all that while the Bijuudama wasn't redirected. The Bijuudama just vanished, but it wasn't redirected at all at that moment

XD Thank you now I could use that in my other Minato debates, his kunais now are considered prep time. No but seriously, with that logic I can say a good portion of the arena will be covered with enton since he did it before why not now U_U

Well if we go like this, we could say that almost everything needs prep time. Since every ninjas prepare themselves for battle. Kunais for example could also be considered as preparation

He redirected it because it was heading towards him. Unless Sasuke is charging to him he can't teleport him, or he needs a marking on Sasuke but that is unlikely with Susano'o and enton.

No, the Bijuudama was stationary at that moment, having made contact with Hachibi trying to block it, but it still got redirected. It happened also when Minato warped Kyubi in another location:

Spoiler

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He made no contact with him whatsover.

Or here as well

Spoiler

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Like you can see, he was far from the kunai in question. And it's not the only examples. Everything shows that FTG has a radius, so Minato warping away Sasuke(Susanoo or not) is more likely to happen

 

[ninthgate]

Just to remind you, Minato's shunshin was so fast that it was capable to leave even the strongest characters like Hashirama or great shunshin users like Tobirama in the dust. Funny thing is that those same Hokages also left Sasuke behind him. Quite the forshadowing explaining the gap in speed that we have between Minato and Sasuke U_U

Edos don't get tired from moving. Real human characters do. Maybe Sasuke wanted to conserve his energy, or keep pace with Juugo?

Sasuke won't need movement speed to fight minato. He can just stand there and only move his head around if he wants.

 

[pateuvasiliu]

Edos don't get tired from moving. Real human characters do. Maybe Sasuke wanted to conserve his energy, or keep pace with Juugo?

When did a ninja get tired from running in Naruto?

 

[TheEvilOne]

Sasuke wins.

 

[Edosadman]

I say Minato high difficulty. He could easily use his Chakra arms to drag Sasuke out of his Susanoo, then Rasengan to the face. Chakra arms could get in and out of Susanoo and enton right?.