[Discussion] A Money-less Society

[Kenotthib]

Does this not make sense? (This article is kind of long)

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[Naruto D Luffy]

Huh huh !

 

[Uchiha Josephus]

Money only holds value when there is something behind it.

The U.S. used to have the gold standard (all money was backed by gold), silver at one point too, but now it is backed by the government (somehow). It's very abstract. =D

Anyhow, even if you don't have dollars and coins, you will still be trading with objects that will act like money because everything has a value.

And since this is cumbersome for everyday dealings, our ancient ancestors decided to use coins instead of goats. However, such bartering is still used in the world today. Though I would imagine it'd be hard to pay for a house in goats.

EDIT -> as far as a "share everything" society -> that only works if everyone is on board. And good luck with that. People will only provide goods and services when they receive something in return.

 

[The Western Wheel]

Jacques Fresco?

I am familiar with the system. And I fully support it. Any develloped human being would understand the necessity of a resource based system.

Don't worry. We will most likely get to that anyways when we start to colonize other planets. I doubt money in this form will be introduced there.

 

[YowYan]

Jacque Fresco, right? Brilliant mind

 

[Kenotthib]

The more I read the more money seems less relevant.

 

[Darthlawsuit]

The big problem with this system is some people don't even treat the stuff they own right. If everything is shared these same people will break all the shared resources and the people who treat stuff right will lose out.

These people that break everything tend to be the ones that don't have anything of value because they waste their money rebuying stuff. My family has never made a huge amount of money and because of that I treated everything I had with respect and it lasted a long time, I ended up getting a lot since I didn't have to replace broken stuff (I didn't break it).

Unless you can somehow deal with leeches and irresponsible people a shared system cannot work. Right now those irresponsible people are isolated to their own belongings and only hurt themselves.

 

[Kenotthib]

The big problem with this system is some people don't even treat the stuff they own right. If everything is shared these same people will break all the shared resources and the people who treat stuff right will lose out.

These people that break everything tend to be the ones that don't have anything of value because they waste their money rebuying stuff. My family has never made a huge amount of money and because of that I treated everything I had with respect and it lasted a long time, I ended up getting a lot since I didn't have to replace broken stuff (I didn't break it).

Unless you can somehow deal with leeches and irresponsible people a shared system cannot work. Right now those irresponsible people are isolated to their own belongings and only hurt themselves.

Good point, all I can say is I hope there comes a day where all humans beings care for one another, and where humans discards ignorance for a higher level of thinking.

 

[Darthlawsuit]

Good point, all I can say is I hope there comes a day where all humans beings care for one another, and where humans discards ignorance for a higher level of thinking.

I hope so as well, but I doubt it will ever arrive. Best thing we can do is not violate one anothers rights and most people will get along just fine.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

It's a good concept, but not applicable for now.

 

[Aim64C]

Good point, all I can say is I hope there comes a day where all humans beings care for one another, and where humans discards ignorance for a higher level of thinking.

That would require a lower level of thinking combined with suppression of individual identity.

Higher order thinking requires introspection that develops 'self' and one's individuality. This is what we call 'sentience.' Ultimately, a sentient being should be able to recognize the benefits of working with other sentient beings (and non-sentient beings) to achieve compatible goals and to communicate information that would be advantageous.

That said - any sentient being is going to have personal goals and motivations. The individuality that spawns from the higher order of thinking, itself, will not be so easily cast aside for the benefits of others. While most people will be quite willing to compromise on issues and to agree to a concept of fair trade/exchange... they will not, in the slightest, respond well to suppression of their individual self. It is, unfortunately, inevitable that individual goals and objectives will (even if inadvertently) lead to the suppression of other individuals.

Anyway - only small tribal systems can work on a system of shared wealth/productivity/ownership. The larger your population gets, the easier it is for individuals to exploit the trust of others and be merely a parasite to the system. Which is why larger societies and unfamiliar individuals use a bartering system. In this context, a person is a temporary part of the tribal community (where others are a constant influence and continual interaction/monitoring) and the person must offer a contribution the tribe finds acceptable for the requested goods/service. That is, often, a good or service that they do not often have access to (in the case of traveling merchants and people bearing news). In larger societies, it's often something of immediate need or of a secondary bartering value.

In order to standardize and make many of these transactions simpler, many governments coin a currency of exchange that its population can use for standard bartering purposes.

The currency often has little/no real value. Even 'backed' currencies are only 'backed' so far that silver and gold are perceived to have value. If there were a society on the planet that did not value the precious metals - then backing a currency with gold or silver would be no different than backing it with wood-chips, here. The bartering system requires that the individuals see the exchange being of equivalent value. You can tell me a kilogram of gold is worth 3 high-end computer systems all day - I could look you right in the eye and say that your gold was worthless to me and I'll only accept 25 bitcoins per system... and you look at me before saying: "WTF is a bitcoin?"

Though a currency backed by some finite resource (or that -is- a finite resource) is often preferable to one that merely says: "I am worth something! I came from a government-managed printing press!"

 

[Professor Finesser]

I thought this said a "monkey less society" that would've been a much better thread....

 

[Disquiet]

I largely agree with the article. Though due to human nature it's impractical. That's not to say human nature can't be broken, because it can. Through will, motivation/desire, and a dissatisfaction of such a society (society based on money). If these feelings are mutually universal, then it's plausible. However, the human in us (All the cries we do for attention and 'hey I'm better than you', and the need to feel superior/better in eyes of others coupled with greed) will be reincarnated so to speak in the following generations.


There's another human characteristic that may counteract this for a while, and that's the fear of drastic change(assuming there will be people who are in favor of their current money-less society) coupled with the perceivable imaginary steps they climbed. It's human nature to at least be apathetic toward opinions and ideals that which to revert/change something we worked hard to establish. The current banner on this site for example, after the designer put so much hard work into it, he or she will/may be very reluctant to change it anytime soon if the reason is solely because some people don't like it. You may become upset with your friend if you spend days painting their car, and then they said they want it back to the original color. You may get upset with your spouse if you spent nearly all day shopping and they nitpick and nag about items they didn't want/need. When our minds perceive that we did a lot or came a long way, we can be easily irritated by opposing opinions and ideals. This may delay changing back to a money society on a world-wide scale at least.


Though perception will probably become blurred over the generations. At the very least, there will probably be many wars in not only in gun-to-gun combat; but secrets political wars, and many wars consisting of ideals (Not to mention family skirmishes) and so on in every following generation.


Then again, since this world and concept only exist in our heads, I'm speaking rather unknowingly here. The overall happiness of such a society will play a large role as well.

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

Best thing we can do is not violate one anothers rights and most people will get along just fine.

That is going to be a problem.