[Debate] Feminism, LGBT rights, and abortion.

[FreakensteinAG]

i didnt say you need love you do need and have lust for sexual intercoarse which is what all animals that sexually reproduce have
i never said animals were like us so much so that they had the same moralities as humans

So can you please reiterate where among this and the posts I created where you don't understand how homosexuality is a natural trait among animals? I can be more specific about the Evolutionary benefits homosexuality has on a population if you wish...

 

[FuChomei]

Be careful of multi-posting and spamming, goodnight!

 

[ballerjordan]

Abortion isn't right in any way.

I don't support gay's either.

 

[Disquiet]

theres no proof that the bible has beens altered
if it was altered then there wouldnt be proof of the things told in the bible so technically i do have proof
in the bible it said that giants roamed the earth

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You are showing those pictures to a very skeptical person. I don't even fully believe in the discovering of all those dinosaur bones.


I don't blame anyone though. We humans are all alike. Be it God or the big bang/evolution. We all believe things indirectly. Why? Because we must. Rather it's the bible or a multitude of science and history books, we place faith in the accounts of other people and their words without question. Otherwise, we don't have the answers. A lot of people have yet to witness half the stuff they believe in, be it religion, science, or history. We all want answers, and will believe what we want. We choose what's convenient to us.

It's a shame religious people and believers of evolution don't get along more, we are more alike than we know.

 

[hixa kuogame]

You can prove that those are actual skeletons? Also, the idea that a man fit two of every species of animal onto a boat is just plain silly

it wasnt a "boat" it was an ark
an ark is about the size of two or three cruise ships i could say
if you seen the movie "2012 the arks at the end of the movie are about the same size and you most realize that there werent as many animals back then
id say there were about 1000 species of animals
its very possible and those skeletons are real you can go search the articles yourself
google is your friend

 

[FreakensteinAG]

It's a shame religious people and believers of evolution don't get along more, we are more alike that we know.

As this is a good learning experience for those unsure, I would like posts to be on-topic with the actual discussion on the acceptance of these three points (which is why I wasn't posting on any of the Biblical text parts, because they aren't needed).

The only thing that is of actual importance is to stress the Biological advantages of having homosexuals in your population, which is why the traits of homosexuality is still alive today and why homosexuality is a natural trait, and why we can observe....other animals.....doing it....

 

[hixa kuogame]

So can you please reiterate where among this and the posts I created where you don't understand how homosexuality is a natural trait among animals? I can be more specific about the Evolutionary benefits homosexuality has on a population if you wish...

it isnt natural amonst animals its more like an adopted sensation
like i said its not natural and going back to the beginning god didnt make a man and a man not adam and steve but adam and eve that was the original way thats what makes it heterosexuality natural and homosexuality being unnatural

just like a womens hair
if its altered or added with weave its becomes unnatural

You are showing those pictures to a very skeptical person. I don't even fully believe in the discovering of all those dinosaur bones.


I don't blame anyone though. We humans are all alike. Be it God or the big bang/evolution. We all believe things indirectly. Why? Because we must. Rather it's the bible or a multitude of science and history books, we place faith in the accounts of other people and their words without question. Otherwise, we don't have the answers. A lot of people have yet to witness have the stuff they believe in, be it religion or science. We all want answers, and will believe what we want. We choose what's convenient to us.

It's a shame religious people and believers of evolution don't get along more, we are more alike than we know.

we technically have witnessed god and if your skeptical then i guess it cant be helped
and we cant get along because our beliefs for the most part contradict

 

[Disquiet]

As this is a good learning experience for those unsure, I would like posts to be on-topic with the actual discussion on the acceptance of these three points (which is why I wasn't posting on any of the Biblical text parts, because they aren't needed).

The only thing that is of actual importance is to stress the Biological advantages of having homosexuals in your population, which is why the traits of homosexuality is still alive today and why homosexuality is a natural trait, and why we can observe....other animals.....doing it....

Hmmm I suppose I could argue your points with religion.

In the end though, we believe the same concerning this matter.

My reason for not discriminating against homosexuals has more to do with the natural emotion, love. *** is just as natural, and thus doesn't seem totally illogical for it not to be limited to the same gender. If a male doesn't feel turned on by a woman, but gets these emotions when looking/being with a man, then it's only right to deem it natural. At the very least, there's no reason to look down upon them. It has more to do with the emotions, than the flesh.

it isnt natural amonst animals its more like an adopted sensation
like i said its not natural and going back to the beginning god didnt make a man and a man not adam and steve but adam and eve that was the original way thats what makes it heterosexuality natural and homosexuality being unnatural

just like a womens hair
if its altered or added with weave its becomes unnatural



we technically have witnessed god and if your skeptical then i guess it cant be helped
and we cant get along because our beliefs for the most part contradict

Well as I stated earlier, to keep this thread from getting closed, I'm just going to drop this debate.

 

[KartoffelChan]

I'm going to try to split up my opinions on each of these so first up, Feminism.

I think Feminism is a great thing, if done right. There's a difference between Feminism and Misandry, and it would be best if everyone kept that in mind. Many so called 'Social Justice Warriors' are really just Misandrists, and especially the insane ones. As a person whose on tumblr a whole lot I see a lot of dumb and or insane 'Feminist' that pretty much ruin the meaning of the whole cause and make me, a female who supports feminism, wince in shame. In a perfect world women and men would be treated equally, but I don't see equality coming in that front anytime soon. It'll take just as long if not longer for women to be on equal footing as men based off of our species history itself~ Still, that doesn't mean we shouldn't try! As a minor note I'm in a major thing about our 'rape culture' and how girls are taught 'Don't wear this or you'll get raped and deserve it' type thing while boys aren't taught, 'Don't rape anyone ever! Under no circumstances is it alright!' [And yes, I do know that men get raped as well too!]

Second up is LGBT rights! I, myself, am bi and I'm currently in a long term relationship with my girlfriend [My sweet Alice <3], and I would one day like to have my relationship treated like it's a 'straight one'. One where nobody cares as long as we aren't harming people [psychical harm, I really don't care about your fee-fees] and don't' try to define, fetish-ize, or become in awe of my relationship just because I'm in one with the same ***... Also, there is a difference in a civil union and a marriage! Marriage is also not a magical title earned by straight people! We must remember that marriage was pretty much originally a contract and usually based upon land/money/family ownership rather than 'love' and 'children being born'~ The bible is another thing I could rail road spike but all I'll say is, "Christianity is not everyone's religion." Basically, I don't mind if you agree with my opinion, but don't be a jerk about it! I don't believe in structured religions, mainly because I feel that my connection with God is different and I find most of the bible to be...odd.

My God is basically watching us like we're his ant farm. He likes to just watch and only occasionally step in to our world, he's not a wish granter after-all, but he is always listening. And I think he created us all, ergo he loves us to a certain extent! I also believe that evolution was a real thing [Afterall I was in a family with my dad being a biochemist with a side degree in anthropology, lol~] but that sometimes when 'we' [or whatever was evolving at the time] got stuck he would give us just a quick shove in the right direction, rather like a parent. So basically, God is a proud parent who only punishes those who cause harm to others for their own gains and basically loves us all.

The last issue is abortion... I believe that abortion is and should be legal. I am pro-choice and I really don't think that a bunch of white old dudes should be telling me what I can and can't do with my own inner organs :/ This relates to feminism and I think one of the best lines I've heard about this is, "No vagina/uterus, no opinion." I wish abortions didn't have such a stigma in our society and I wish people would see how bad making abortions illegal/super pricey would be an awful thing.

Anyone who has been involved in abortion issues should totes know what happens during a legal and 'safe' abortion, as well as what desperate women do for illegal and unsafe ones. I won't go into details, I'm sure y'all could google it, but women have died from them. Some poison themselves, and others...I remember one in particular, and it's surprisingly common. To make a gore-y story short, a woman used a coat hanger and ended up poking a hole in her intestines. She was only 22 years old and I can't remember if she lived or not [I think she did], but she would never be able to carry children ever at all. I would also like to note that just because abortions are legal doesn't mean that people should be using them for birth control! Even 'safe' and legal procedures can leave scars and I personally probably won't nor ever would get one [even though, like I stated before I'm in a lesbian relationship], but that doesn't mean that I think nobody else should. It's a personal issue, let said person solve it themselves.

 

[Nous]

I am homosexual so obviously I am for LGBT Rights, I'm pro-Feminism (like real feminism, not that stupid hippie stuff) and pro-Choice.

 

[Naruto D Luffy]

I don't believe it

 

[shonu]

Well But In our religion,Its mentioned somewhere that humans Of the previous generations were of heights 10 or 12 feets!!:erm:

OT: I am Against abortion in cases like infanticide,Female foeticide! And about Feminism,Yeah I'm Feminist but not an Extreme One!!

 

[Zachfri]

Im sorry but people choose who they like all the time. If I see a pretty girl I like then one day hate her because she's a ***** to me I just chose not to like a person I liked in the first place. I don't see why being gay would screw that up.

 

[Jack Spicer]

This is a weird post in that I'd like to address an issue I've encountered with ALLOT of girls and guys. Whenever I ask them about feminism they automatically say "I want equal rights, but i'm not a feminists." Or when I ask about gay marriage some people have said "I want gays to have equal rights, just not be able to get married." What do you guys think about Feminism and Gay rights/marriage? (I know the first couple of sentences don't have much toward the topic but I've really been bugged by these people.) I'm a feminist that's pro LGBT rights and pro-abortion. Sorry about my horrid typing ^^;

I've never experienced this, but it irks me just reading about it. If people just say that and not vote against it nor treat people differently, then whatever, but they do vote against it and do treat people differently. That's so uncool, man. I'm all for equality with everyone. As for abortions, legalize it. I'm pro everything you said. Just let everyone be happy. It'll make more happiness, ease stress, and, this is so important to the government, save money.

 

[Cornson]

I am Pro women's rights, they should have the same rights as men do, and wise worse, no gender should have more rights than the other, so you could say that I am Pro "equal" rights, no matter what gender.

I am Pro Gays right to marry, why should they not be allowed that basic right just because they are attracked to the same gender if you are against it, you are against gay people having the same rights as strait people... (WTF is wrong you! :devil: HOW DARE YOU TAKE BASIC HUMANS RIGHTS AWAY FROM PEOPLE!) If it wore up to me it would give jail time when you advocate the rights of others to be taken away.

I am Pro abortion, it's the women's body, so she should have the choice if she want to go true with the pregnansy or not.

 

[shelke]

A controversial debate. I think people should stop with this bigotry; it's 21st Century for the love of god. Also, people should just accept it that religion, nationalism, and any ideal/school of thought is a subjective factor. It's absolute lunacy to believe that every man/woman should follow the ideals set in your chosen school of thought. It's preposterous.

I think abortion should be legalized, as not everyone is fit to raise children, nor is the world population in this 'kids for every home' reality in its favour. I am really serious about it. People should just go by equal rights. I don't understand why feminists and misogynists even exist. I understand that in third world and muslim countries feminism is a necessity, but in the west it makes little sense.

 

[Cornson]

the fact that homosexuality is unnatural still stands it is also fact that its against biblical doctrine

how can something that accures in nature betwean many different species be unnatural? it's litterly the definition of natural... -.-' /facepalm

and so what if "homosexuality" stand against biblical doctrine, the bible is nothing but a book written by bronze age people with bronze age knowledge (hence why it's filled with racism, biguatry and abselutely wrong on almost every single scientific claim...)

pretty much the only good think in the bible is the "golden rule" treat others how you want to be treated, and they even stole that from other religions...

being attracted doesnt mean you love the opposite *** it means you lust the sin itself

and your right being attracted to someone dosen't mean you love them... what's your point?

no matter how much you say it is a choice doesnt mean it is

and no matter how much you say it is a choice dosen't change reality...

ohh and if it is a choice chose to be gay

you have no real proof other than theories do you?

there are a ton of proof for it, you pretty much just need to look at scientific book about the subject, read a paper on the studies about sexuality to get the proof you as asking for (not that you want the proof, then you can't go and say "give me the proof, it's just theories")

the proof already exist, all you need to do is google it.

but killing simply because the mother made a bad choice is wrong

if it got no brain (no conciousness) and if it dosen't have nerves (so it can't feel pain) and have no organs (it cuden't survive a second without the mother) then how can it be alive?

because im living and the fact that there is a book pertaining to his existence

what does you being alive got to do with anything (it just means that 2 people had ***, the female was pregnant, you wore born)

there are more countless of different holy books that each are devoted to their own god, does the existance of those books also prove that all the other gods also exist?

how do you kno GOD doesnt exist?

First of all it's you that claim god exist so you have to provide proof that he acutally does, I don't have to disproof your claim of the god you belive in...

but to answer your question:

I don't know if the god you belive in exists or not (neither do i know if santa, the lockness monster or bigfoot exists) but when there are abselutely no evidence of "somethings" existances, then the logical stance is to not belief in it, untill it have been proven to exist.

and yes i kno he exist because hes in the bible

all the other gods are in their religious books aswell, so they also exist right?

you kno he doesnt exist because current day scientists say so

I don't know if he exists or not, but why should I belief something exists when there are no proof of them? (same reason I don't belive in unicorns, leprechauns, faires or dragons)

if evolution was the case then why is it that only some species actually evolved

all species evolve everytime a new member of a species is born it's genetic code is slightly different from it's parents (that is evolution, nothing more nothing else)

this is why animals mate with more than one spouse and incest

first of all there are some animals that only take 1 "mate" their intire life (on top of my head I can't name any, but google it and you shall find out) and incest well, that is also known to happen with humans to...

the bible has only been altered under reasons i have already explained

you are mistaken, thats all I can say, it have been proven that it have been altered many, many times.

if it was altered beyond the origin then people wouldnt have known what noaks ark was when it was found

noa's ark could have been added later? and you do know that noas ark never have been found right? it's a fiction, it never happended...

(and there are no proof what so ever that there ever have been a world wide flood, and if there ever had been we would have died out long time ago) (if all the salt water got mixed with fresh water no animal or plant would have been able to surive it)

I never said i believed in evolution except for in short cases

what do you mean with short cases? and a shame really, it's basic science, it really is, if you can't even belief that then I don't see how you could ever get a grade higher than F in biology class...

theres no proof that the bible has beens altered

there are plenty of proof, there have been dosent of documentaries on the subject.... + every time a religous person goes out in the world and tryes to proof that the bible never have been altered, what he finds is proof that it actually have been, countless of times...

in the bible it said that giants roamed the earth

and yet there are no proof that they ever did... sure there have been humans born with "gigantism" but they are not giants... and the bible also states that unicons exist...

Abortion isn't right in any way.

then I wish you had been born a girl and raped by your dad! which would have resulted in you becomming pregant with a baby that would evolve with a broken liver, which would resoult in your death prior to the baby being born. (are you telling me in such a case abortion would not be the right thing to do?)

I don't support gay's either.

I don't suport your rights.

we place faith in the accounts of other people and their words without question.

you may do that, but I don't I don't have "faith" in anything really, I try to belive as many true things as possible and as few false things as possible, and when/if I get pointed out that something in belive in is wrong/false, then I stop beliving in it.

otherwise, we don't have the answers.

it's okay not knowing all the facts about life

it's better to say that we don't know something, than just saying "because we don't know something, GOD DID IT!"

A lot of people have yet to witness half the stuff they believe in, be it religion, science, or history. We all want answers, and will believe what we want. We choose what's convenient to us.

but I don't need to withness all the scientific knowledge the human species have gathered, it's enough that i know that thousands of other people have see it, and that all that knowledge have been proven to be correct.

and you are right people will belive what ever they want, I can't stop them from beliving abselute nonsence

It's a shame religious people and believers of evolution don't get along more, we are more alike than we know.[/QUOTE]

It's hard to get along with people that keep saying that I will go to hell every time I try and have a talk about their religion (after they find out that I am an atheist) and you do know that there are many religious people that actually belive in both evolution and religion right? (there are also many that belive in gravity)

id say there were about 1000 species of animals

first of all where do you get that number from? and if there really only existed 1000 animals back then "when the flood was claimed to have happended) then there could never have been as many different species that there does today... there exist more spiders world wide than 1.000 ...

its like saying that the alfabet starts at A and ends at D... (clearly false)

its very possible and those skeletons are real you can go search the articles yourself

it isen't really, instead of only getting your sources from religious sides, how about you try and find out what the oppesition is saying to it? you might actually learn something.

google is your friend

it is, and you should try and use it...

 

[Disquiet]

you may do that, but I don't I don't have "faith" in anything really, I try to belive as many true things as possible and as few false things as possible, and when/if I get pointed out that something in belive in is wrong/false, then I stop beliving in it.



it's okay not knowing all the facts about life

it's better to say that we don't know something, than just saying "because we don't know something, GOD DID IT!"



but I don't need to withness all the scientific knowledge the human species have gathered, it's enough that i know that thousands of other people have see it, and that all that knowledge have been proven to be correct.

and you are right people will belive what ever they want, I can't stop them from beliving abselute nonsence


It's hard to get along with people that keep saying that I will go to hell every time I try and have a talk about their religion (after they find out that I am an atheist) and you do know that there are many religious people that actually belive in both evolution and religion right? (there are also many that belive in gravity)

Faith and belief are interchangeable. No deeper meaning there.


Case and point. You believe these 'true' things without ever having to see them. Be it history, science, etc. If you are saying that you are one of millions that don't do this, then good for you.


Did I ever say it wasn't okay? Tell that to the scientist. I'm sure they are going to continue to search.


You do know in the spiritual world, there have been reported multiple accounts of 'spirits', 'devils', 'exorcisms', and looooots of other of happenings all around the world? Yeah thousands of people have reported to see this and it's 'true' or 'proof' to a lot of people. Some may see this as good vs evil, god vs satan.


Well it being 'nonsense' is very debatable. Some scientist were ridiculed for their ideas. The inability to prove it, doesn't mean it's not true.


lol you're taking the wrong stance here. That's an open statement. If you feel like it's because of religious people that you can't get along with them, then fine. That's your personal experience and reasoning. In fact, the majority of my post was an open statement, but you tried to center it around your idea and experiences. I'm fine with that, as long as you are aware that you're one of millions and millions of the people I was referring to in my post.

 

[Cornson]

Case and point. You believe these 'true' things without ever having to see them. Be it history, science, etc. If you are saying that you are one of millions that don't do this, then good for you.

first of all I would never bee able to read every single "true" things we know without a shadow of a doub to be true, even if I has 500 years to do so (where I dien't need to sleep, eat or do anything, just read, and read, I would not be able to read it all)

You do know in the spiritual world, there have been reported multiple accounts of 'spirits', 'devils', 'exorcisms', and looooots of other of happenings all around the world?

and yet, when scienties look at these reports there are never any proof of their existance.

Yeah thousands of people have reported to see this and it's 'true' or 'proof' to a lot of people.

Eye witness accounts is the weakest kind of proof, not matter what it is your trying to prove, it's by far the most unreliable, and I don't care if people claim that they have see "supernatural things" if it can't be backed up with any "real proof" then it can also be dismissed without any.

Well it being 'nonsense' is very debatable.

if it can't be proven, then I see no reason to belive in it, the exact same why why I find the idea of the flat earth to be ludacrus.

Some scientist were ridiculed for their ideas. The inability to prove it, doesn't mean it's not true.

well that is true, just because something can't be proven does not mean it's false, but it most sertently does not make it true! (or even logical to belive in it)

lol you're taking the wrong stance here. That's an open statement. If you feel like it's because of religious people that you can't get along with them, then fine.

I have also met religious people that haven't said that (but I have never met atheist that say I will go to hell) (people that say that tend to be overwelmingly religious)

 

[Disquiet]

first of all I would never bee able to read every single "true" things we know without a shadow of a doub to be true, even if I has 500 years to do so (where I dien't need to sleep, eat or do anything, just read, and read, I would not be able to read it all)




and yet, when scienties look at these reports there are never any proof of their existance.




Eye witness accounts is the weakest kind of proof, not matter what it is your trying to prove, it's by far the most unreliable, and I don't care if people claim that they have see "supernatural things" if it can't be backed up with any "real proof" then it can also be dismissed without any.



if it can't be proven, then I see no reason to belive in it, the exact same why why I find the idea of the flat earth to be ludacrus.



well that is true, just because something can't be proven does not mean it's false, but it most sertently does not make it true! (or even logical to belive in it)




I have also met religious people that haven't said that (but I have never met atheist that say I will go to hell) (people that say that tend to be overwelmingly religious)

When scientist look at these reports? This is along the lines of the first point in your reply. This proof may simply be beyond the grasp of our human capabilities.


...You can't understand the point of my post. We all believe things we have yet to see with our own eyes. Your 'arguments' if you'd like to call them that, have only been confirming that. Again, whether it's science or religion, we put our trust in things we haven't even witnessed.


You admitted that you do this. I do this. Everyone does this. My post that you originally replied to was neutral. As I, tend to have an open mind about science and the spiritual. I welcome both worlds.


Having said that, knowing my stance on this matter. What are you even trying to argue with me about? lol