COME ON IN im fine

[Disquiet]

You know what?
Your theory might be plausible.
I remember Itachi stating that Kotoamatsukami needed time to recharge, hence, he could not use it on Sasuke.
Which means the eye's power must have been used on someone or something before it was passed on to Itachi by Shisui.

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But... here is where the problem starts. If Shisui did indeed use it on Itachi... his right eye should have converted back into a simple 3 tomoe sharingan prior to the techniques activation? Which it did not. (or maybe it simply wasn't shown due to the fact that he plucked out the eye after he activated Kotoamatsukami?) More so is the fact that when a Dojutsu based technique activates itself there would be a sound effect indicating that the technique was used.

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In the image you showed there was none... I am not saying your theory is impossible.

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There was a sound effect but I think it was just the hand grasping the eye.
Or it could've been Kotoamatsukami activating itself, Lol.

And it's still not clear whether Kotoamatsukami affects the target eternally even upon the original casters death. In my honest opinion, it doesn't. If it can... don't you think when Kabuto was affected by Kotoamatsukami Itachi would've used the same method Shisui used on him? Also, when plucking out an eye... I don't think the eye which was plucked out of it's socket from an Uchiha can still use a Mangekyou technique. It's like saying Obito can use Kamui on Kakashi's eye.

I don't know if this post of mine is relevant to the topic being discussed but oh well...

And you still didn't post a counter argument on Kotoamatsukami being canceled out upon a users death.
Sorry I don't know what I am posting. I hope my English doesn't suck enough to the point that you cannot understand it. Sorry.

Well the argument about KA being activated when handed to Itachi is kinda redundant and nullified now that you revealed it was already used, but still active. In other words, Itachi couldn't use it on Sasuke because it was already used, but it was still active when Shisui gave it to him.


No offense, but I'm not even sure what you are trying to say with your other arguments. Itachi use KA on Kabuto? The crow and the eye was destroyed. Well that's very debatable, I mean we saw Danzo using Izanagi while eyes were in his arm.

But like I said, since KA was clearly active after being used, then it means Shisui could have used it before plucking out his eye. Since deactivation upon use of tech, obviously does not apply to him.


Does it cancel when the caster dies? I don't remember reading that anywhere. Though if there's proof, it would indeed dismantle this theory.

 

[edo tensai wilmaso]

I already debated this with you hehe ... So you know how I feel on this .... Good luck trying to change her mind guys.

 

[foxyladyland]

You know what?
Your theory might be plausible.
I remember Itachi stating that Kotoamatsukami needed time to recharge, hence, he could not use it on Sasuke.
Which means the eye's power must have been used on someone or something before it was passed on to Itachi by Shisui.

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If Shisui did indeed use it on Itachi... his right eye should have converted back into a simple 3 tomoe sharingan prior to the techniques activation? Which it did not.

prior means before, so why would the effects of the jutsu wear off before it is cast??
it doesn't work like that. when it was coming out of naruto's mouth it was still MS. Later it downgraded to 3 tomoe.
its the Left eye. That is the only eye that came into contact with itachi. the Left eye only.

(or maybe it simply wasn't shown due to the fact that he plucked out the eye after he activated Kotoamatsukami?)

exactly. when looking at panels you don't see every motion happening.
for instance: we never saw Shisui hand the eye over to itachi, we saw him clinch it in his hand,
but he might have placed it inside itachi the same way itachi did to naruto(but without the crow

More so is the fact that when a Dojutsu based technique activates itself there would be a sound effect indicating that the technique was used.

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notice when the crows eye is first shown, it doesn't have any words or symbols around the eye.

In the image you showed there was none... I am not saying your theory is impossible.

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There was a sound effect but I think it was just the hand grasping the eye.
Or it could've been Kotoamatsukami activating itself, Lol.

there was a sound effect when shisui had his fingers on his eye socket while it was still in,
there were also sound effects when he held it in his hand saying "protect konoha"
now, shisui covered the eye up with his fist, but when Danzo used it he also had it covered with bandages.

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also Shisui could have been able to use genjutsu with his finger (or arm) like itachi.
Danzo had shisui's cells imbedded in his right arm + shoulder and still used KA with eye covered.

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Also Shisui could've pointed it the eye at itachi(we never saw him give it to him)
don't forget, the crow had the eye, and the crow cast it on itachi, via itachi's orders before he died.

And it's still not clear whether Kotoamatsukami affects the target eternally even upon the original casters death. In my honest opinion, it doesn't. If it can... don't you think when Kabuto was affected by Kotoamatsukami Itachi would've used the same method Shisui used on him?

it doesn't effect the user eternally after the user dies, nor if they live I suppose.
Mifune did snap out of it, after Danzo stopped using it but KA was explained at the summit.
however itachi did think it would work on sasuke, which was sasuke's goal anyway
(sasuke only left the leaf to get stronger to defeat itachi) figured sasuke would want to return home afterwards.
never happened

Also, when plucking out an eye... I don't think the eye which was plucked out of it's socket from an Uchiha can still use a Mangekyou technique.

it worked in a crow also it was still in shisui's possession when he went to see itachi , even after he plucked it out.

It's like saying Obito can use Kamui on Kakashi's eye.

NO IT IS NOT.

And you still didn't post a counter argument on Kotoamatsukami being canceled out upon a users death .

KA worked on Itachi still after the crow & eye were destroyed.
not to mention, Kabuto is still in Izanami

Sorry I don't know what I am posting. I hope my English doesn't suck enough to the point that you cannot understand it. Sorry.

I perfectly understand

Damn my last post.

Danzo is not fool.
You think Danzo dont know what power Shisui had ? Dont you think Danzo knew evrything about shisui. He was afraid of his power?
After all he had shinobys who can penetrate to person mind and ect.
And if he could take one eye why you think he couldnt take and second ?
If danzo want to take both eyes why he need shisui than anymore he coulded just kill him and take both eyes.
He is smarter than you think. Without KA Shisui was useless.
My theory is much much posible than yours. Your theory is made from 3-5 other theorys.

what you just said is not a theory. those are questions.
also I've already answered you. If taking the Sharingan from a living Uchiha was that simple,
he would've gotten Sasuke's
not to mention Shisui is know for his body flicker I assume he used it to escape Danzo
after the right eye was stolen.

 

[TJ0001]

wow....hmmm ok i read a lil more on this and im still kinda thinkin X3. i havent given up yet!

I remember you saying that itachi would never think to murder his own family, or that he couldnt bring himself to do it. (either that or your assistant). im not 100% on how kotoamatsukami works, i think i have the jist of it though, im not clear on whether or not the person under its influence can still be conscious enough to feel and stuff like that.

if not, then itachi crying as he murdered his parents would be a plausable counter to the theory (i think)

X3 its kind of tough to look through too seeing as itachi and shisui shared ideals. im still thinking on it though.

 

[edo tensai wilmaso]

I'm only gonna say this... I feel that KA was not used .... They both had the same resolve and way of thinking... They were ahead of their clansmen and would rather die for their village then their own clan also we don't know 100 percent how KA works itachi said it takes 10 years to activate from the coup de tat and where they are now It hasent been ten years so how could itachi use it again? Consider today's manga ... Where Hiruzen stated that they were best friends ... Why would your best friend do that to you ... If shisui did use KA then that means he did not trust itachi.

 

[foxyladyland]

wow....hmmm ok i read a lil more on this and im still kinda thinkin X3. i havent given up yet!

I remember you saying that itachi would never think to murder his own family, or that he couldnt bring himself to do it. (either that or your assistant). im not 100% on how kotoamatsukami works, i think i have the jist of it though, im not clear on whether or not the person under its influence can still be conscious enough to feel and stuff like that.

if not, then itachi crying as he murdered his parents would be a plausable counter to the theory (i think)

X3 its kind of tough to look through too seeing as itachi and shisui shared ideals. im still thinking on it though.

you can still feel and show emotions (edo itachi still showed emotion to sasuke and even felt remorse for kabuto
don't forget though. the order would've have been "protect konoha" not "kill Uchiha or its enemies"
don't forget either Itachi still reacted as any normal human would while he was Edo the whole time during the war.
also I said Itachi wouldn't WANT to murder his own family, not that he couldn't go through with it.

now further about a persons willingness and determination,
Itachi is just like Shisui, however Shisui could KA to stop the rebellion(non violence)
Itachi didn't have KA so he could either choose talking(didn't work) or killing(worked and violence)
also Itachi knew Sasuke left the village to get stronger to defeat HIM; sasuke would hopefully return once itachi is dead.
however itachi didn't trust Sasuke enough, so he programmed KA to make him go back to Protect the Leaf.
Itachi admitted he didn't trust Sasuke enough , so it doesn't surprise me if Shisui would cast KA on Fugaku(clan leader)
or even cast it on Itachi.
Lol Shisui inherited Hashirama's will, and Hashirama told Madara that he will protect the Leaf from anyone trying to destroy it.
Hashi said he wouldn't forgive his own kids if they tried to destroy the Leaf.

 

[TJ0001]

you can still feel and show emotions (edo itachi still showed emotion to sasuke and even felt remorse for kabuto
don't forget though. the order would've have been "protect konoha" not "kill Uchiha or its enemies"
don't forget either Itachi still reacted as any normal human would while he was Edo the whole time during the war.
also I said Itachi wouldn't WANT to murder his own family, not that he couldn't go through with it.

now further about a persons willingness and determination,
Itachi is just like Shisui, however Shisui could KA to stop the rebellion(non violence)
Itachi didn't have KA so he could either choose talking(didn't work) or killing(worked and violence)
also Itachi knew Sasuke left the village to get stronger to defeat HIM; sasuke would hopefully return once itachi is dead.
however itachi didn't trust Sasuke enough, so he programmed KA to make him go back to Protect the Leaf.
Itachi admitted he didn't trust Sasuke enough , so it doesn't surprise me if Shisui would cast KA on Fugaku(clan leader)
or even cast it on Itachi.
Lol Shisui inherited Hashirama's will, and Hashirama told Madara that he will protect the Leaf from anyone trying to destroy it.
Hashi said he wouldn't forgive his own kids if they tried to destroy the Leaf.

awww D: i thought i was onto something there. oh well X3 its a good theory anyhow.

 

[foxyladyland]

I'm only gonna say this... I feel that KA was not used .... They both had the same resolve and way of thinking...

Thinking and resolve are different.
Itachi was never faced with having to kill his clan before and you see how long it took for Itachi to finally do something.
up until Shisui's death and Danzo's orders, Itachi had only talked to Sarutobi about the plot.
He also had conversations with Fugaku , but it wasn't shown that Itachi said anything about the plot at all to him.
He was mostly being given a pep talk about his role in the plot.

now thinking and doing are 2 different things.. Shisui tried to DO something by using KA.
Itachi had only been talking and thinking about the plot.
Itachi had Reasoning ,(knew what had to be done to stop the plot , somewhat)
but that doesn't mean he would have done what he did before Shisui's death.(kill his parents)

They were ahead of their clansmen and would rather die for their village then their own clan

yes they would die for the leaf & itachi for Sasuke (leaf shinobi)

also we don't know 100 percent how KA works itachi said it takes 10 years to activate from the coup de tat and where they are now It hasent been ten years so how could itachi use it again?

that's right it has only been 8 years. however itachi placed the crow inside naruto.
naruto UZUMAKI with KURAMA the 9 tails fox chakra
(which is used the same way as senju dna, and Uzumaki are relative of the senju.)
it speeds up jutsu availability, with its life force and presence.
Itachi said he couldn't use it on sasuke because it takes 10 years reactivation time..
so that means it was used already so itachi couldn't use it on sasuke..
he gave it to naruto knowing uzumaki/9tails chakra could give a similar effect as senju dna.

Consider today's manga ... Where Hiruzen stated that they were best friends ... Why would your best friend do that to you ... If shisui did use KA then that means he did not trust itachi.

okay. Best friends?? what about brothers. Itachi put Sasuke in a coma, traumatized him somewhat.
why wouldn't he KA itachi to Protect the Village?? it doesn't say kill. it says protect.

TRUST
simply put: Itachi wanted to protect the village.. but he hadn't done anything to stop the plot..
Shisui made sure with KA that he would actually DO something to Protect it
as opposed to just wanting to and thinking about it.

once again im not saying it actually happened....im giving plausibility to it being possible.

 

[Organis Machinas]

Thinking and resolve are different.
Itachi was never faced with having to kill his clan before and you see how long it took for Itachi to finally do something.
up until Shisui's death and Danzo's orders, Itachi had only talked to Sarutobi about the plot.
He also had conversations with Fugaku , but it wasn't shown that Itachi said anything about the plot at all to him.
He was mostly being given a pep talk about his role in the plot.

now thinking and doing are 2 different things.. Shisui tried to DO something by using KA.
Itachi had only been talking and thinking about the plot.
Itachi had Reasoning ,(knew what had to be done to stop the plot , somewhat)
but that doesn't mean he would have done what he did before Shisui's death.(kill his parents)

yes they would die for the leaf & itachi for Sasuke (leaf shinobi)


that's right it has only been 8 years. however itachi placed the crow inside naruto.
naruto UZUMAKI with KURAMA the 9 tails fox chakra
(which is used the same way as senju dna, and Uzumaki are relative of the senju.)
it speeds up jutsu availability, with its life force and presence.
Itachi said he couldn't use it on sasuke because it takes 10 years reactivation time..
so that means it was used already so itachi couldn't use it on sasuke..
he gave it to naruto knowing uzumaki/9tails chakra could give a similar effect as senju dna.


okay. Best friends?? what about brothers. Itachi put Sasuke in a coma, traumatized him somewhat.
why wouldn't he KA itachi to Protect the Village?? it doesn't say kill. it says protect.

TRUST
simply put: Itachi wanted to protect the village.. but he hadn't done anything to stop the plot..
Shisui made sure with KA that he would actually DO something to Protect it
as opposed to just wanting to and thinking about it.

once again im not saying it actually happened....im giving plausibility to it being possible.

wow...you should deff do this more often! i enjoyed reading that, i wish it was longer!

 

[edo tensai wilmaso]

Thinking and resolve are different.
Itachi was never faced with having to kill his clan before and you see how long it took for Itachi to finally do something.
up until Shisui's death and Danzo's orders, Itachi had only talked to Sarutobi about the plot.
He also had conversations with Fugaku , but it wasn't shown that Itachi said anything about the plot at all to him.
He was mostly being given a pep talk about his role in the plot.

now thinking and doing are 2 different things.. Shisui tried to DO something by using KA.
Itachi had only been talking and thinking about the plot.
Itachi had Reasoning ,(knew what had to be done to stop the plot , somewhat)
but that doesn't mean he would have done what he did before Shisui's death.(kill his parents)

yes they would die for the leaf & itachi for Sasuke (leaf shinobi)


that's right it has only been 8 years. however itachi placed the crow inside naruto.
naruto UZUMAKI with KURAMA the 9 tails fox chakra
(which is used the same way as senju dna, and Uzumaki are relative of the senju.)
it speeds up jutsu availability, with its life force and presence.
Itachi said he couldn't use it on sasuke because it takes 10 years reactivation time..
so that means it was used already so itachi couldn't use it on sasuke..
he gave it to naruto knowing uzumaki/9tails chakra could give a similar effect as senju dna.


okay. Best friends?? what about brothers. Itachi put Sasuke in a coma, traumatized him somewhat.
why wouldn't he KA itachi to Protect the Village?? it doesn't say kill. it says protect.

TRUST
simply put: Itachi wanted to protect the village.. but he hadn't done anything to stop the plot..
Shisui made sure with KA that he would actually DO something to Protect it
as opposed to just wanting to and thinking about it.

once again im not saying it actually happened....im giving plausibility to it being possible.

I've never bashed on this theory I quite like it but that doesn't necessarily mean I agree with it tough...I like how you take what I say I flip it around lol itachi did that to Sasuke because he wanted Sasuke to kill him and be a hero. shisui was on the verge of death and gave his eye to itachi so that danzou won't take the other one as well. 8 years passed and itachi hid it to naruto. I've heard about danzou using "hashi cells" not senju cells and naruto doesn't have hashi cells so my deduction is that the same time frame still stands of 10 years.

I also heard that uzumaki have high chackra reserves and high life forces(they live long). But no where does it say that they can speed up a dojutsu, it's sharingan if anything it takes chackra away from the user not actually replenishing the jutsu.

 

[Sea Of Thy Soul]

prior means before, so why would the effects of the jutsu wear off before it is cast??
it doesn't work like that. when it was coming out of naruto's mouth it was still MS. Later it downgraded to 3 tomoe.
its the Left eye. That is the only eye that came into contact with itachi. the Left eye only.

I wasn't clear on this one... What I originally intended to say was that his Mangekyou should've reverted back to it's 3 Tomoe version after activating Kotoamatsukami. Also, I think Kotoamatsukami needed time to recharge for another decade when Shisui handed it to Itachi.

exactly. when looking at panels you don't see every motion happening.
for instance: we never saw Shisui hand the eye over to itachi, we saw him clinch it in his hand,
but he might have placed it inside itachi the same way itachi did to naruto(but without the crow
notice when the crows eye is first shown, it doesn't have any words or symbols around the eye.

That's because it wasn't using anything yet...

there was a sound effect when shisui had his fingers on his eye socket while it was still in,
there were also sound effects when he held it in his hand saying "protect konoha"
now, shisui covered the eye up with his fist, but when Danzo used it he also had it covered with bandages.

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Danzo had shisui's cells imbedded in his right arm + shoulder and still used KA with eye covered.

Read the scan again.
At the botton panel, it says GRASP a sound effect indicating the hand grasping the eye.
We really haven't seen Danzo use Kotoamatsukami in a panel with bandages on.
When he fought Sasuke I remember him undoing the bandages so that he can use KA.

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If what you are saying is true... why did Danzo remove the bandages and risk receiving damage from a potential blizt just so he could remove the bandages?

also Shisui could have been able to use genjutsu with his finger (or arm) like itachi.

Without facts to back it up, this is merely a hypothesis.

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Also Shisui could've pointed it the eye at itachi(we never saw him give it to him)
don't forget, the crow had the eye, and the crow cast it on itachi, via itachi's orders before he died.

I don't understand this part.

it doesn't effect the user eternally after the user dies, nor if they live I suppose.
Mifune did snap out of it, after Danzo stopped using it but KA was explained at the summit.
however itachi did think it would work on sasuke, which was sasuke's goal anyway
(sasuke only left the leaf to get stronger to defeat itachi) figured sasuke would want to return home afterwards.
never happened
it worked in a crow also it was still in shisui's possession when he went to see itachi , even after he plucked it out.

Your theory i Shisui casting Kotoamatsukami on Itachi to convert his mindset... then if you also admit that it doesn't affect someone eternally Itachi should've became 'evil' once again.
Itachi was planning on using Kotoamatsukami on Sasuke to explain the whole truth about the clan through mental communication. At least, that is what I think.

NO IT IS NOT.

I thought you said Shisui is capable still of using his Mangekyou even after plucking it out from it's socket.

KA worked on Itachi still after the crow & eye were destroyed.
not to mention, Kabuto is still in Izanami

Izanami and Kototamatsukami are two different techniques.
Izanami confines the target in an infinite/ never ending loop.
Kotoamatsukami... maybe.

I perfectly understand

Thanks, I guess.

 

[foxyladyland]

I've never bashed on this theory I quite like it but that doesn't necessarily mean I agree with it tough...I like how you take what I say I flip it around lol itachi did that to Sasuke because he wanted Sasuke to kill him and be a hero. shisui was on the verge of death and gave his eye to itachi so that danzou won't take the other one as well. 8 years passed and itachi hid it to naruto. I've heard about danzou using "hashi cells" not senju cells and naruto doesn't have hashi cells so my deduction is that the same time frame still stands of 10 years.

I also heard that uzumaki have high chackra reserves and high life forces(they live long). But no where does it say that they can speed up a dojutsu, it's sharingan if anything it takes chackra away from the user not actually replenishing the jutsu.

quit saying I flip your words, you know I don't do that.
I hope you're not hinting that the bold part is something I said cuz its not.
and shisui wasn't on the verge of death; he just had his eye taken out....
now maybe he was poisoned or took a critical hit, but he appeared okay enough to do all he did after his eye was stolen..

okay, you're right about hashi's cells, but that story goes back to uchiha and senju dna combining..
and naruto has always shown great healing since he started doing missions with team7.
its either because of his uzumaki blood or 9tails chakra , or both. kushina also stayed strong after kurama was extracted from her.

you've seen the 9tails chakra replenish so many shinobi during this war and giving them chakra and stamina.

the uchiha eye is like anything that is strained too much and gives in to the strain and has to lower itself and power down.
that's what KA does to the eye.. it causes it to revert back to 3 tomoe after KA is used..and cannot be used for ten years.

when it reverts back, its because it loses life force...get it? now here is where it gets not so tricky .
naruto in his KM mode is rich with life force...

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[foxyladyland]

Spoiler

I wasn't clear on this one... What I originally intended to say was that his Mangekyou should've reverted back to it's 3 Tomoe version after activating Kotoamatsukami. Also, I think Kotoamatsukami needed time to recharge for another decade when Shisui handed it to Itachi.


That's because it wasn't using anything yet...


Read the scan again.
At the botton panel, it says GRASP a sound effect indicating the hand grasping the eye.
We really haven't seen Danzo use Kotoamatsukami in a panel with bandages on.
When he fought Sasuke I remember him undoing the bandages so that he can use KA.

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If what you are saying is true... why did Danzo remove the bandages and risk receiving damage from a potential blizt just so he could remove the bandages?


Without facts to back it up, this is merely a hypothesis.


I don't understand this part.


Your theory i Shisui casting Kotoamatsukami on Itachi to convert his mindset... then if you also admit that it doesn't affect someone eternally Itachi should've became 'evil' once again.
Itachi was planning on using Kotoamatsukami on Sasuke to explain the whole truth about the clan through mental communication. At least, that is what I think.

I thought you said Shisui is capable still of using his Mangekyou even after plucking it out from it's socket.


Izanami and Kototamatsukami are two different techniques.
Izanami confines the target in an infinite/ never ending loop.
Kotoamatsukami... maybe.

Thanks, I guess.

- oh yeah I know it would go back to 3 tomoe...but after shisui had that close up where he was looking at his missing eye socket, we didn't get a good view on his eye after that; then the next panel is of shisui touching his eye socket... in that scene you cant tell if his eye is MS or 3tomoe....so he could have done it there
- about the crow: yeah I know it wasn't doing anything yet I was just testing you
-here danzo controls mifune with KA while his sharingan is covered

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-about evil itachi's mindset...he was never evil...he wanted to stop the plot , but didn't know how...
and wasn't sure if he would actually do anything yet...he only thought & talked up to that point...
but Shisui use KA to order him to protect konoha...protecting is actually doing something vs just thinking.
-who knows how long it (KA) worked on Itachi though. Itachi wanted to protect konoha alive & edo form.
so if it wore off at some point, we wouldn't know when it happened.(cuz itachi acts the same)
-but when Danzo stopped using it on Mifune, AO explained how KA works
so Mifune broke out of it because of the explanation or cuz Danzo released him.
-shisui can use KA while his MS is in his hand , and
itachi can program it to work on someone after his death as it did.
it was in a crows eyesocket instead of any humans & it worked on itachi.
-izanami is breakable, once you accept your faults , actions and discover the loop, you can break out of it.

 

[DeDoll]

prior means before, so why would the effects of the jutsu wear off before it is cast??
it doesn't work like that. when it was coming out of naruto's mouth it was still MS. Later it downgraded to 3 tomoe.
its the Left eye. That is the only eye that came into contact with itachi. the Left eye only.

exactly. when looking at panels you don't see every motion happening.
for instance: we never saw Shisui hand the eye over to itachi, we saw him clinch it in his hand,
but he might have placed it inside itachi the same way itachi did to naruto(but without the crow
notice when the crows eye is first shown, it doesn't have any words or symbols around the eye.

there was a sound effect when shisui had his fingers on his eye socket while it was still in,
there were also sound effects when he held it in his hand saying "protect konoha"
now, shisui covered the eye up with his fist, but when Danzo used it he also had it covered with bandages.

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also Shisui could have been able to use genjutsu with his finger (or arm) like itachi.
Danzo had shisui's cells imbedded in his right arm + shoulder and still used KA with eye covered.

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Also Shisui could've pointed it the eye at itachi(we never saw him give it to him)
don't forget, the crow had the eye, and the crow cast it on itachi, via itachi's orders before he died.

it doesn't effect the user eternally after the user dies, nor if they live I suppose.
Mifune did snap out of it, after Danzo stopped using it but KA was explained at the summit.
however itachi did think it would work on sasuke, which was sasuke's goal anyway
(sasuke only left the leaf to get stronger to defeat itachi) figured sasuke would want to return home afterwards.
never happened
it worked in a crow also it was still in shisui's possession when he went to see itachi , even after he plucked it out.

NO IT IS NOT.

KA worked on Itachi still after the crow & eye were destroyed.
not to mention, Kabuto is still in Izanami

I perfectly understand


what you just said is not a theory. those are questions.
also I've already answered you. If taking the Sharingan from a living Uchiha was that simple,
he would've gotten Sasuke's
not to mention Shisui is know for his body flicker I assume he used it to escape Danzo
after the right eye was stolen.

Yea sure.

You dont see even my post. What an nub.You made conclusion that danzo come alone and try took his eye. I never say it. As i told Danzo was smart ambu leader, why he should do anything alone when he have tons of ninja who obey him ? Shisui can beat all ambu no.

He took his one eye, Because catch him off guard? Are srsly think so. Danzo was prepared for this. And fight vs sasuke he wasnt. Here Shisui was one vs all ambu and when danzo fight vs Sasuske it was 1v1 unprepared. Its imposible for shisui. escape from all ambu alone who is prepared to catch. And after that he just simple met itachi without big rush or something. Why ? Coz he dont escape. Danzo let him go. Everyone saw how Shisui going together with Itachi lots of time after eye steal. No1 searching Shisui why? Coz no1 need him.

End of case if you still can say Ambu < Shisui you more stupid than i think.

 

[DeDoll]

You know what is your problem. You just cant admit that some else is right. You will tell Shisui > Madara if you need it. You lost this long time ago.
You made so many others smaller theorys.

My theory that Danzo knows evrything about Shisui you didt deny. You just told Shisui > Danzo & ambu.

 

[foxyladyland]

Yea sure.

You dont see even my post. What an nub.You made conclusion that danzo come alone and try took his eye. I never say it. As i told Danzo was smart ambu leader, why he should do anything alone when he have tons of ninja who obey him ? Shisui can beat all ambu no.

He took his one eye, Because catch him off guard? Are srsly think so. Danzo was prepared for this. And fight vs sasuke he wasnt. Here Shisui was one vs all ambu and when danzo fight vs Sasuske it was 1v1 unprepared. Its imposible for shisui. escape from all ambu alone who is prepared to catch. And after that he just simple met itachi without big rush or something. Why ? Coz he dont escape. Danzo let him go. Everyone saw how Shisui going together with Itachi lots of time after eye steal. No1 searching Shisui why? Coz no1 need him.

End of case if you still can say Ambu < Shisui you more stupid than i think.

You know what is your problem. You just cant admit that some else is right. You will tell Shisui > Madara if you need it. You lost this long time ago.
You made so many others smaller theorys.

My theory that Danzo knows evrything about Shisui you didt deny. You just told Shisui > Danzo & ambu.

everything you just said in these quotes are flat out ridiculous ; I really think you are trolling.
if you're going to debate then battle the direct arguments and don't make up fake quotes .
you said I said something I didn't say. why?? idk maybe you are a troll who cant debate very wellLol
as if this debate actually had anything to do with danzo' prep for taking shisui's eye...you're mistaken...:bye:
if you pretend someone said something then prove they said it or battle the direct statements.
if you wanna make a theory on danzo taking shisui's eye then make a thread about it.
me helping you out. :bye:

 

[DeDoll]

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They just walking. That means. No1 was try to catch him. Thats means that he dont escape from Danzo but Danzo let him go.

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Here you can see how he say " probably " danzo will gona try take and other eye. So if he would escape from danzo he would know 100% that danzo will try to get his left eye too.

And why you saying that Danzo is fool ? Coz i know he is rly smart and he woudnt let Shisui go out side with KA, Coz he was afraid of KA. And Danzo have methods how to get true from person.

What i am saying Danzo took his eye which had KA, and leave Shisui with one eye which was ucharged. Other wise danzo was a fool.

 

[Sea Of Thy Soul]

- oh yeah I know it would go back to 3 tomoe...but after shisui had that close up where he was looking at his missing eye socket, we didn't get a good view on his eye after that; then the next panel is of shisui touching his eye socket... in that scene you cant tell if his eye is MS or 3tomoe....so he could have done it there

Okay, you proved your point that Danzo is able to activate Kotoamatsukami whilst his eye is being covered.
I understand that... but, it's really incomprehensible that your theory states that Shisui used his Mangekyou after his eye was plucked out from it's socket. It really doesn't make sense at all. There is no proof that an Uchiha who just finished plucking out his eye can even activate a Mangekyou technique from the eye which he plucked out. In short, he doesn't have control over that eye anymore...

- about the crow: yeah I know it wasn't doing anything yet I was just testing you
-here danzo controls mifune with KA while his sharingan is covered

Spoiler

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Okay, I understand this.

-about evil itachi's mindset...he was never evil...he wanted to stop the plot , but didn't know how...
and wasn't sure if he would actually do anything yet...he only thought & talked up to that point...
but Shisui use KA to order him to protect konoha...protecting is actually doing something vs just thinking.
-who knows how long it (KA) worked on Itachi though. Itachi wanted to protect konoha alive & edo form.
so if it wore off at some point, we wouldn't know when it happened.(cuz itachi acts the same)

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That should explain it from a canon's perspective.

-but when Danzo stopped using it on Mifune, AO explained how KA works
so Mifune broke out of it because of the explanation or cuz Danzo released him.

-shisui can use KA while his MS is in his hand , and
itachi can program it to work on someone after his death as it did.
it was in a crows eyesocket instead of any humans & it worked on itachi.
-izanami is breakable, once you accept your faults , actions and discover the loop, you can break out of it.

Yeah because it had a host that acts as the main trigger for the techniques activation.
In Shisui's case... it doesn't.
I wouldn't be surprised if Itachi modified that crow somehow to do his bidding.
Obito has done it once by manipulating the Mizukage.

I know...

 

[DeDoll]

everything you just said in these quotes are flat out ridiculous ; I really think you are trolling.
if you're going to debate then battle the direct arguments and don't make up fake quotes .
you said I said something I didn't say. why?? idk maybe you are a troll who cant debate very wellLol
as if this debate actually had anything to do with danzo' prep for taking shisui's eye...you're mistaken...:bye:
if you pretend someone said something then prove they said it or battle the direct statements.
if you wanna make a theory on danzo taking shisui's eye then make a thread about it.
me helping you out. :bye:

Are you srsly. I told danzo took his one eye, right ? You agree about this.

And you say that eye was with Ka which was used before.
But thats makes Danzo a fool. Coz he took Shisui eye that he coudnt use KA agains leaf village. Am i right ?

And Danzo know everything about Shisui powers ? Other wise why he took his eye if he dont know his power. And he could know all details about his eyes because he had lots of ninja with mind penetration and stuff like that.

And my last point is that Shisui coudnt run from Danzo and Anbu. Danzo was prepared for his eye displantation. He did't do it randomly. And i don't see how he could escape if they could take one eye. So they let him go. Because he made no threat until his left eye would recharge. Only this make sence.

This make sence ?

 

[foxyladyland]

Spoiler

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They just walking. That means. No1 was try to catch him. Thats means that he dont escape from Danzo but Danzo let him go.

Spoiler

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Here you can see how he say " probably " danzo will gona try take and other eye. So if he would escape from danzo he would know 100% that danzo will try to get his left eye too.

And why you saying that Danzo is fool ? Coz i know he is rly smart and he woudnt let Shisui go out side with KA, Coz he was afraid of KA. And Danzo have methods how to get true from person

I've pointed out the fact that they(itachi , Shisui) were standing around talking while at the river, but
we never saw this Danzo eye stealing incident so Shisui could've have landed a blow back on him.(a critical one)
and Danzo with his illegal drugs and medicines and power-ups could've been hiding his pain around the others like itachi and the elders afterwards. since we didn't see the incident we don't know exactly how it happened. Also the reason Danzo didn't show up to the river is maybe he didn't know where shisui fled to, or didn't want to challenge Shisui and Itachi at the same time, or too much noise and commotion would wake the uchiha clan up which is where shisui likely was when Danzo attacked him. So Danzo could've let him go because he was already using KA when Danzo stopped him and took the eye(thinking he was using the other eye) so he knew it wouldn't work for at least a decade. Did you forget Shisui is known for his body flicker??? that technique powered by Sharingan & at night time is really enhanced. Also if he kept up with shisui then a loud commotion would eventually ensue and the uchiha would wake up and civil war will start and that is something the elders were trying to avoid.

Okay, you proved your point that Danzo is able to activate Kotoamatsukami whilst his eye is being covered.
I understand that... but, it's really incomprehensible that your theory states that Shisui used his Mangekyou after his eye was plucked out from it's socket. It really doesn't make sense at all. There is no proof that an Uchiha who just finished plucking out his eye can even activate a Mangekyou technique from the eye which he plucked out. In short, he doesn't have control over that eye anymore...
Okay, I understand this.

Spoiler

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That should explain it from a canon's perspective.
Yeah because it had a host that acts as the main trigger for the techniques activation.
In Shisui's case... it doesn't.
I wouldn't be surprised if Itachi modified that crow somehow to do his bidding.
Obito has done it once by manipulating the Mizukage.
I know...

im not saying that he used it after it was plucked out, im saying its a possibility that he could program it the same way itachi did, to react to itachi's sharingan so in or out of the socket, the eye would still react if programmed.
also danzo had shisui's dna in arm and shoulder and right side of body while eye was covered, and still used KA..
Itachi can also use genjutsu on you while only pointing a finger. So with that being said about Danzo and Itachi, Shisui who was itachi's idol and the reason itachi unlocked MS(most likely) and Shisui's dna on Danzo's right side could indicate that Shisui could prob use genjutsu with his limbs as well....and while being able to do that and program his own eye, he could prob use KA on itachi while holding the eye in his hand and pointing it at him or even while covering the eye up, and using the power from it on his target...Shisui's blood was all over his hand with the eye ; Itachi transferred his jutsu into Sasuke's eye while touching his forhead and his own blood dripping into Sasuke's eye which activated amateratsu to react to Tobi's sharingan which is a jutsu sasuke has never used before being programed to use yet he still performed it.
itachi's reasoning: you saw how hard it was for him to kill his parents and you seen how long it took for him to finally do something to try and stop the plot which was previously just talking. after the last time he met shisui, is the first time he actually started to take action. reasoning is knowing the possible outcome and the reason behind it being know matter good or bad, but understanding what must be done and the reason for it... itachi knew , but hadn't done.. so shisui tried on his own.. Itachi knew what needed to be done(possibly) but didn't know when or how..
so he might not have done it if it wasn't for shisui's last moments however he might have still met up with tobi and murdered them in their sleep...It was extremely hard for itachi and he cried intensely as he murdered his parents... he might not have brought himself to do previously while knowing what must be done...,but shisui ordering him to with KA could have forced him to take action and protect the village instead of just thinking about it..
here we see itachi admit his faults from back then...he could've found another way to stop the plot...he thinks..

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