Hiruzen Strength Completely Analysed

[Owarij]

I've been wanting to make this thread for a while , But I have some time on my hands, so i thought why not t.t
In this thread I'll completely analyse ever aspect of hiruzen sarutobi, all his feats, hype, and i'll throw in a few guesses as well

Ninjutsu, genjutsu and taijutsu

- Without a doubt, Hiruzen Sarutobi was if not is one of the most skilled ninjas when it comes to all the forms of ninja combat, Not saying that there aren't others who have surpassed him individually, But i don't believe anyone has surpassed his expert allroundedness...

We are first introduced to Sarutobi Hiruzen as Hokage of the leaf village.. His skill in nijutsu rivaling that of Hatake kakashi , in that he was capable of using over 1000 different types of jutsu

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Ofc this is no small feat, Having an arsenal of that amount of jutsu would take a very long time for most, but it would ensure that you have a counter for almost every attack possible in a battle..

Further information on Hiruzen, by orochimaru, indicates that he was once given the title Professor

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Hiruzen, at one point in the past was able to use EVERY existing Konoha jutsu ,

Do note orochimaru's wording, he not only spoke in past tense , but used the word existing.. meaning operating at a current time... This means hiruzen was not able to use every konoha jutsu that EVER existed.. He is not sayinig that... Hiruzen was able to use every jutsu, of the people currently alive in Konoha.. which would probably include ninjas like Sakume hatake ... .

If you've read this far you're probably thinking that using every existing konoha jutsu would require 5 elements? , Well yes, I'm here to explain to you that Hiruzen had 4-5 elements, He may not have had wind since it's rare in Konoha, but it's likely at least one person had it ...

I already know you're going to say

"It's impossible to have 5 elements , without rinnegan that is"

WRONG , infact Anyone can learn all the elements, it would just take a ridculous amount of time for most.. But hiruzen is no normal ninja...He is a genius with skills in ninjutsu beyond anyone ever seen in the manga bar nagato.... Members of his clan also seem to have some sort of talent in learning jutsu extremely fast, as seen with konohamaru ....

But back to the chakra,

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In this first databook page, you see kishi says " While it depends on the person, Most individuals can tap into one chakra nature easily. At the jonin level, most can use two or more"

This corelates with what Kakashi said.. NOWHERE has kakashi said that 1 or 2 was your limit... he simply said that you are born with an AFFINITY... this is the element that best suits you... You learn it easier than all the rest... Jonins, usually have their affinity + one other element..

Further proof that anyone can learn 5 elements is

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Kishi's clear and exact words- " Mastery of all natures can take years of training"

^ , I do hope this will end the debate on whether a person can get 5 elements.. The thing different about Nagato was that he was capable of doing it at a VERY young age, IMPOSSIBLE for most....

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Hiruzen was stated in the manga to be incredibly skilled in genjutsu, knowing over 1000 of them ALONE .... and mastering each one... along wiith the 5 he was giving in databooks, it shows his expertise in this skill..

Hiruzen's taijutsu in his old form was still extremely good... despite it being significantly weaker than his prime performance according to enma... He was still armed with tricks that even orochimaru missed and was surprised at..

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Prime
Hiruzen's prime state, has been given unrivaled hype throughout this manga... there is no other character but the so6p that was given any better hype than him...

We have his statement from iruka

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Stating that he was considered the strongest hokage of all.. Note this is not a direct statement, nor is it Iruka's OPINION..... iruka is simply stating, that a majority of people , consider Hiruzen as the strongest of the former hokage....

Next up we have Kabuto's statement ..

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Kabuto, if you haven't realized, Is a very informative person... He has been a spy all his life and thus has a load of knowledge from past and present events... He has spied in every village since a child , and knows things others don't know

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So when kabuto says that a majority of people consider hiruzen to have been the strongest kage, once again it isn't his opinion.. it's the opinion of many villages, data that he's collected over years ,the opinion of masses.. that hiruzen was without a doubt stronger....

But what makes hiruzen this strong? what made him so powerful that people would call him a god of shinobi?
We have a man that has mastered ninjutsu, all forms... Trained by both the former hokages, And who's databook ranking in his old age, scored almost all 5's...

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Apart from the things that would have obviously declined with age...

Here we have hiruzen's statement that unlike before , he found enma heavy, showing a significant decrease in strength..

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enma's statement that, his overall performance in taijutsu was lacking...

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and finally statements by anbu members that hiruzen's chakra has significantly decreased since his prime, which affects his stanima greatly

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People bring up that fight oro as an attempt to bellitle his power, and call his hype lies... but they fail to realize that he was just in a horrible condition..

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One where his stanima is ridiculously low, he can't use any of his powerful jutsu, or ANY chakra taxing jutsu.. nothing...

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A man who could not perform in battle..
jutsu like moukouton, which orochimaru and enma hinted he could have dodged, he wasn't able to...

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as enma said.. the battle was NOTHING like him atall..

But even then, even though hiruzen was so incredibly weak compared to his prime, Kishi still considered old hiruzen equal to oro..

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I'm not even nearly done with this thread i just looked at it though, and its too long , haven't even gotten to enma, which is a thread by himself...

 

[Zawar]

ok Hiruzen was big cheez
then...he was but not now

nice work btw

 

[siyo]

Great thread bro, however the trolls will probably ruin it with fanboyism (they even got a new word)

 

[Owarij]

ok Hiruzen was big cheez
then...he was but not now

It's impossible for you to have read it that quickly >< ..

Great thread bro, however the trolls will probably ruin it with fanboyism (they even got a new word)

Lol thx, at first It was going to be a - A ninja without rinnegan can learn 5 elements thread,
but i thought Meh, i'll just make this a hiruzen thing..


But any genius ninja , given the right amount of training and time, can accomplish it


non genius ninja - Naruto, with the method taught to him by kakashi can master all the elements by about high 20's .26 etc

 

[Sir Blades]

hiruzen ftw

 

[Deadai]

You see Owarij this is why you are one of my favorite members on NB because you explain things in such detail if I didint allready rep you so much in the past I would +rep you right now great job my friend

 

[silmarill]

I hope 1 day Kishi will lets us see what a powerfull shinobi Hiruzen was in his prime
nicely made

 

[Zawar]

It's impossible for you to have read it that quickly >< ..

i didnt when i posted
but i have now xd
i just wanna be first to post xD

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

I read it and I still don't care for Hiruzen because fanboys always say that he could beat people like Edo Madara or Nagato, which unless he were lucky and used the death reaper seal, he couldn't even pull a draw against.

That is my main issue with Hiruzen.

 

[9Bijuu]

It's impossible for you to have read it that quickly >< ..






Lol thx, at first It was going to be a - A ninja without rinnegan can learn 5 elements thread,
but i thought Meh, i'll just make this a hiruzen thing..


But any genius ninja , given the right amount of training and time, can accomplish it


non genius ninja - Naruto, with the method taught to him by kakashi can master all the elements by about high 20's .26 etc

Kind of rude to tell someone they can read things quickly. I read this in about a minute, it's not that long - just seems longer because you didn't spoiler the pictures.

Also, if Naruto mastered one element in a few days why would it take him four years to a decade to master all of the elements?

Interesting thread, a little disorganized but I liked it. +rep

EDIT: Almost forgot, didn't it say that Hiruzen mastered over 1,000 ninjutsu, not genjutsu as you stated?

 

[-Blade-]

Hiruzen vs Danzo flashback might happen hopefully Danzo gets Edo'd

 

[Blaze Release]

Exceptional thread. To be expected U_U
Do i agree with you?. Im not sure.

 

[Owarij]

I read it and I still don't care for Hiruzen because fanboys always say that he could beat people like Edo Madara or Nagato, which unless he were lucky and used the death reaper seal, he couldn't even pull a draw against.

That is my main issue with Hiruzen.

ofc hiruzen can't beat nagato and madara -_- , Iv'e seen people say minato, and itachi can beat them to.. recently kisame... I've even seen jiraya..

all characters will always have fanboys who exaggerate their abilities

 

[Ryuu..]

You know exactly what I think of this thread.

 

[siyo]

Lol thx, at first It was going to be a - A ninja without rinnegan can learn 5 elements thread,
but i thought Meh, i'll just make this a hiruzen thing..


But any genius ninja , given the right amount of training and time, can accomplish it


non genius ninja - Naruto, with the method taught to him by kakashi can master all the elements by about high 20's .26 etc

I agree, but it was an extreme rarity which Jiraiya also commented on when he was talking about rinnegan. Hiruzen made perfect sense though since he not only had large chakra reserves, but he was also a prodigy who was a frequent user of the shadow clone jutsu.With that he could duplicate Naruto's feats, as you also pointed out, and learn at a much faster rate.

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

ofc hiruzen can't beat nagato and madara -_- , Iv'e seen people say minato, and itachi can beat them to.. recently kisame... I've even seen jiraya..

all characters will always have fanboys who exaggerate their abilities

True but Hiruzen fanboys just scream about his hype as a ninja, and his prime self.

Minato can't beat either of them in a straight up battle, but he could run away well xd

Itachi, well I do think Itachi has his chances against Nagato, not with his paths.

Kisame and Jiraiya, now that is just overshooting things though. The only way Jiraiya would be able to beat them is if he set a trap and already had the frog genjutsu ready to go.

 

[Blaze Release]

Owarij how do you cut the manga bits you want. I know how to do it, but its a long process. If there is a shorter process vm me

 

[zombiejesus]

yea he was great. i think he was best hokage but it is my opinion

 

[iSpeak]

Nice thread

 

[Owarij]

Kind of rude to tell someone they can read things quickly. I read this in about a minute, it's not that long - just seems longer because you didn't spoiler the pictures.

Also, if Naruto mastered one element in a few days why would it take him four years to a decade to master all of the elements?

Interesting thread, a little disorganized but I liked it. +rep

EDIT: Almost forgot, didn't it say that Hiruzen mastered over 1,000 ninjutsu, not genjutsu as you stated?

if its short i'll write the enma part now

and did naruto master wind element? i'm not sure, i'll go check, but he learned how to use it, and then created 1 s rank jutsu , that was it, But that was his affinity element.. which according to kishi is easy training to master.... Now mastering a non affinity element will take ridicoulous time..

But kurama isn't sucking his chakra, or attempting to take him over, infact kurama can give him chakra, so that would reduce his training time as he can now increase his amount of clones.. he may just be able to do it in 2 years ..or less O.O considering kurama was said to have "unlimited" chakra , if not unlimited, aloooot..

and nah, viz scan stated 1000 genjutsu

you can buy the books

Owarij how do you cut the manga bits you want. I know how to do it, but its a long process. If there is a shorter process vm me

idk any short way :S, i just drag it into paint, crop it, save it , upload to imagur, takes like 10 secs