Obama administration issues guidance on transgender access to school bathrooms

[ComplexCity]

Re: Transgender Restroom

Check the edited post. I explained why the bill is being passed. Negative reaction would be stronger in bathrooms that blatantly blend male and female populations because the differences would stand out more than transsexual men using the male's bathroom and transsexual women using the female's bathroom. Because a proper transition would make many transsexuals nearly unidentifiable, you wouldn't notice a transsexual in your bathroom as quickly as you would a woman who dresses and carries herself like a woman.



The issue of unisex bathrooms also hasn't been as prominent as the transsexual bathroom issue.



When?

Back in your last post go back and read

 

[ComplexCity]

Re: Transgender Restroom

Because men piss all round the toilet bowl and women leave their blood everywhere. Two disgusting creatures who complain about each other's bathroom habits. Won't be long before public bathrooms turn into battle grounds.

If only this was valid seeing how this is done in the respective genders bathrooms.

Check the edited post. I explained why the bill is being passed. Negative reaction would be stronger in bathrooms that blatantly blend male and female populations because the differences would stand out more than transsexual men using the male's bathroom and transsexual women using the female's bathroom. Because a proper transition would make many transsexuals nearly unidentifiable, you wouldn't notice a transsexual in your bathroom as quickly as you would a woman who dresses and carries herself like a woman.



The issue of unisex bathrooms also hasn't been as prominent as the transsexual bathroom issue.

I don't plan to drag this out, stupid copy and paste messed up my response


In a nutshell, your argument is flawed considering the fact that arguments being made that people won't be paying attention to other people do their business. I don't need you to explain anything to me because I already know. The fact that you're also stating that people's "reaction" to the issue is the reasoning to why I won't be able to use the woman's bathroom is also flawed. Weren't you the one who also stated that home bathrooms are gender neutral?

When?

Back in your other post

 

[ComplexCity]

Re: Transgender Restroom

How many times have you seen a man bleeding or a woman peeing while standing up?

What does that have to do with anything? That's what stalls are for

 

[ComplexCity]

Re: Transgender Restroom

Men only go to bathrooms to piss?

Never hinted, foreshadowed or made this assertion


Edit: Working at a supermarket back in the day, I used to be a janitor as a part of working maintenance. I've seen piss on the toilet seats in the women's bathroom

 

[Punk Hazard]

Re: Transgender Restroom

In a nutshell, your argument is flawed considering the fact that arguments being made that people won't be paying attention to other people do their business. I don't need you to explain anything to me because I already know. The fact that you're also stating that people's "reaction" to the issue is the reasoning to why I won't be able to use the woman's bathroom is also flawed. Weren't you the one who also stated that home bathrooms are gender neutral?

Nope. The argument I was against was that transsexuals using the bathroom of the *** they identify as rather than their biological *** is inherently wrong because it would make people uncomfortable and bring about conflict. My counterargument is that that isn't true because the discomfort isn't significant, at the very least, not more significant than the rights of transsexuals. The major reason this discomfort is irrelevant is because, practically, it can be circumvented by doing what people already do when they use the bathroom: Just do their business and leave.

Because the cause of this discomfort isn't inherent and can be easily circumvented, the cause presented against it isn't very valid. However, this is in theory, that's practically. REALISTICALLY, it isn't that easy. In terms of SHOULD transsexual males/females using male's/female's bathrooms be allowed, yes, it should be. In terms of WOULD they be able to use it without any issue, no they wouldn't, there will be issue. Should that issue stop them, no, it shouldn't. Will it stop them, more than likely not. The same thing applies to unisex bathrooms, except that at this current point in time, social standings suggest the issue will stop it from being implemented.

 

[Made in Heaven]

Trannies just like to play pretend.

 

[ComplexCity]

Re: Transgender Restroom

Probably gonna be my last response

Nope. The argument I was against was that transsexuals using the bathroom of the *** they identify as rather than their biological *** is inherently wrong because it would make people uncomfortable and bring about conflict.

And you're speaking from the viewpoint of everyone right? You don't get to decide how people feel. A state of comfortablity is subjective and I hope no one needs to explain to you why. You don't know what conflict would arise so dismissing it doesn't help your argument either. By your logic, if it could be hidden well enough, I can say that going into a womans bathroom being a cis male, whist dressing as a cis woman shouldn't make people uncomfortable seeing as how I basically blend in if implemented well enough

My counterargument is that that isn't true because the discomfort isn't significant, at the very least, not more significant than the rights of transsexuals. The major reason this discomfort is irrelevant is because

This is what you call being bias. You're basically saying "since the people who are offended that trans people can do this, then basically they need to deal with it since it's not that big of a deal." Which isn't the way this needs to be looked at but instead considering the comfort levels of both parties. Again it doesn't matter what you feel is an approriate level of comfort

practically, it can be circumvented by doing what people already do when they use the bathroom: Just do their business and leave.

By this logic I should be able to walk into a woman's bathroom as long as I do my business and leave

Because the cause of this discomfort isn't inherent and can be easily circumvented, the cause presented against it isn't very valid.

Yet you stated the same thing when I presented you with the same arugment using the same logic you did, yet here you are dismissing the comfort levels of cis people. I.E: Going into the women's bathroom to just do my business, in a stall and nothing else

However, this is in theory, that's practically. REALISTICALLY, it isn't that easy. In terms of SHOULD transsexual males/females using male's/female's bathrooms be allowed, yes, it should be. In terms of WOULD they be able to use it without any issue, no they wouldn't, there will be issue. Should that issue stop them, no, it shouldn't. Will it stop them, more than likely not. The same thing applies to unisex bathrooms, except that at this current point in time, social standings suggest the issue will stop it from being implemented.

But it's not realistic and it will cause problems just like the previous question I asked you

 

[Urda]

All of your arguments are so dumb. :|


Many say this is a good idea - I don't blame them. However, this against people rights: Human Rights and Civil Rights.


The major issues: This is not private companies asking for this to be passed as law, this is GOVERNMENT asking for public bathrooms. There is a difference.

Again, this issues is a distraction....

The legislation doesn’t stop there, however. Tucked inside is language that strips North Carolina workers of the ability to sue under a state anti-discrimination law, a right that has been upheld in court since 1985. “If you were fired because of your race, fired because of your gender, fired because of your religion,” said Allan Freyer, head of the Workers’ Rights Project at the N.C. Justice Center in Raleigh, “… you no longer have a basic remedy.”

“The LGBT issues were a Trojan horse,” added Erika Wilson, a law professor at the University of North Carolina who co-directs a legal clinic for low-income plaintiffs with job and housing discrimination claims. The broader change hasn’t received much attention, she said, because “people were so caught up in [the LGBT] part of the law that this snuck under the radar.”

Source:

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[Uzumaki Macho]

Trannies just like to play pretend.

Do people with adopted kids also like to play pretend?

 

[Made in Heaven]

Do people with adopted kids also like to play pretend?

They don't play pretend because they don't act like they're the kid's biological parent, they don't claim the child came from them, they simply raise them up. Don't go trying to compare two people raising an orphaned child to a man or woman pretending to have a snake or cave.

 

[Lightbringer]

They don't play pretend because they don't act like they're the kid's biological parent, they don't claim the child came from them, they simply raise them up. Don't go trying to compare two people raising an orphaned child to a man or woman pretending to have a snake or cave.

How would you know they're pretending if you've never been in the same position as them?

These are people who are born to a certain gender with a different body. Just because you don't understand them doesn't mean they're pretending. Life is not so simple and nature is sporadic.

 

[ComplexCity]

How would you know they're pretending if you've never been in the same position as them?

These are people who are born to a certain gender with a different body. Just because you don't understand them doesn't mean they're pretending. Life is not so simple and nature is sporadic.

I usually agree with you but there is a condition where believe that they are horses and get sexually aroused from getting ridden like one. Would you say this is normal and should be socially accepted? Not debating on trans acceptance, just want to see your stance

 

[Lightbringer]

I usually agree with you but there is a condition where believe that they are horses and get sexually aroused from getting ridden like one. Would you say this is normal and should be socially accepted? Not debating on trans acceptance, just want to see your stance

People pretending to be horses is not even comparable to people believing themselves being a different gender. Some transgenders can be born with developing parts of their "true" gender.

If you're claiming that they are pretending and that they are just making it up, then do you believe nature is consistent?

 

[ComplexCity]

People pretending to be horses is not even comparable to people believing themselves being a different gender. Some transgenders can be born with developing parts of their "true" gender.

If you're claiming that they are pretending and that they are just making it up, then do you believe nature is consistent?

Consistent is a broad term seeing as how adaptation exist. I am also not claiming that trans people are pretending because I have not been in the same position. However I am challenging the same notion you are presenting to LB which can be said for the other group I am referring to no?

 

[Lightbringer]

Consistent is a broad term seeing as how adaptation exist. I am also not claiming that trans people are pretending because I have not been in the same position. However I am challenging the same notion you are presenting to LB which can be said for the other group I am referring to no?

The difference is that we don't have horse DNA and never will unless we start DNA splicing. Gender can be mismatched.

 

[ComplexCity]

The difference is that we don't have horse DNA and never will unless we start DNA splicing. Gender can be mismatched.

Gender is a social construct and chromosomes determine *** so I'm not really understanding here. This is going off how they feel not the biological facts

 

[Lightbringer]

Gender is a social construct and chromosomes determine *** so I'm not really understanding here. This is going off how the feel not the biological facts

Well while there is a psychological aspect to gender identity, there is no evidence against biological factors as well.

Humans don't know how horses feel nor act on an intimate level nor contain any features of a horse that would make this case as prominent as gender identity.

You said it yourself, if gender identity is a social construct then it is not the fault of the transgenders that they turned out the way they did. They are who they are and we should accept them for that and help them live a comfortable life. It's not like they're hindering our lives in any way by identifying as a different gender.

A lot of them do get *** changes.

 

[ComplexCity]

Well while there is a psychological aspect to gender identity, there is no evidence against biological factors as well.

Humans don't know how horses feel nor act on an intimate level nor contain any features of a horse that would make this case as prominent as gender identity.

You said it yourself, if gender identity is a social construct then it is not the fault of the transgenders that they turned out the way they did. They are who they are and we should accept them for that and help them live a comfortable life. It's not like they're hindering our lives in any way by identifying as a different gender.

A lot of them do get *** changes.

@Bold, there isn't a way for a man to know what a woman feels like as well (I.E periods, menopause), but I do get what you mean. In the rest of that sentence I would also like to point out that the same can be said for a male to female transition as an artificial vagina is still not a real one.

The whole thing with gender is that is mental despite the biological aspects, if this argument can be made for that, then why not the one for horses be made as well?

 

[Made in Heaven]

How would you know they're pretending if you've never been in the same position as them?

These are people who are born to a certain gender with a different body. Just because you don't understand them doesn't mean they're pretending. Life is not so simple and nature is sporadic.

Because there are people who pretend to be animals, objects, and even fictional characters.

Anyways, I don't necassairly have a problem with feminine boys or masculine girls, they can act how they want for all I care, it's the fact that they think they're of the opposite *** when their genitalia, and DNA, are what decided that. The term man refers to a male human, as does the term woman refer to a female human.

Is a transman a female human? No.
Is a transwoman a male human? No.

Then that's that. You can't just change the definition of the word. It's like if I called myself a plant even though, by definition, I am not, and no matter how much I insist I am and cry to the government to ban the big meany bigots to stop making fun of me, it won't change the fact that I'm not a plant.

The whole of humanity can call me a plant, with me dressing in green, coloring my skin green, bathing in the sun and taking up whatever from my rear end, with my legs in the dirt, I still will be nothing more than a human.

You can't change the way the universe works, and the universe, or God for me, has declared that men are men and woman are woman, and no amount of emotional turmoil over such things will change that, even if all the world claims as such.

Think of it like this. Remember when the whole world thought the Earth was flat? Did that make the Earth flat? Nope.

Likewise, even if the whole world thought a transwoman is a real woman or a transman is a real man, that won't change the fact that they're not. Words can't change reality.

 

[Lightbringer]

@Bold, there isn't a way for a man to know what a woman feels like as well (I.E periods, menopause), but I do get what you mean. In the rest of that sentence I would also like to point out that the same can be said for a male to female transition as an artificial vagina is still not a real one.

The whole thing with gender is that is mental despite the biological aspects, if this argument can be made for that, then why not the one for horses be made as well?

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure what you're asking. There have been cases where people were raised by animals and were feral in nature. These people were helped and some were successful, but very rarely. Yes, these people should still retain their rights as a human and we should do all we can to help them adjust to society. But these people are suffering from the most extreme spectrum of psychological confusion and don't grasp human ideological concepts.