Three-Headed Kurama Avatar

[Holy God]

Are you stupid.... Kishi wouldn't make them fuse together if they didn't make it more powerful there would be no reason for showing that

Yall doo the most too make Naruto seem weak but hes the Savior who won the VoTE read the Manga again Kiddo

Naruto > All

I believe the two rivals are equal. It's just that I've seen many people stating that this "Ashura Avatar" makes such a difference compared to his regular.

 

[The Necromancer]

I actually understand the arguments of both parties here. Although, I believe each understands the fundamentals of the Kurama Avatar and the Shadow Clone Jutsu differently.

 

[-Akuma-]

Their two attacks did, yes, but Sasuke's Tailed Beast Susano'o was already too fast and agile for Naruto in his regular cloak. The only reason why the two avatars ended up in a tie is because the fight ended before a close-range confrontation could occur.

Not really if Sasuage could overpower Naruto that easy he would of.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

The three-headed Kurama avatar was also a bit larger (the heads increased in size slightly). Also, the increased size of the tails was meant to show just how much more chakra the avatar had compared to a normal Kurama avatar. Basically, the change in appearance reflects a higher quantity of chakra.


I believe they were evenly matched; the amount of chakra essentially determines the power of the avatars, and they threw everything they had at each other and clashed evenly. It could be argued that Naruto used Wind's advantage over lightning to close a small gap in their power, but I believe they were basically even.

What made 3 headed kurama avatar on par with sasuke's is the large amount of sage chakra kurama absorbed and sent to naruto. You should note that kurama sent that chakra to naruto 'After' naruto created the three headed avatar. No one is arguing he became on par with bijuu susanoo with that large sage chakra, we are saying the three headed kurama avatar on it's own does not really provide any power upgrades.

 

[Holy God]

Not really if Sasuage could overpower Naruto that easy he would of.

In a manga, the characters don't always do what's best for them nor use there full range of powers. If he wanted to, he could have used Amenotejikara while utilizing his Tailed Beast Susano'o to appear right next to Naruto and knock him over again. He wanted to end it quickly and decided to unleash the rest of the chakra he had(which wasn't even the full amount of the tailed beasts') into one attack.

 

[lndra]

No really, think about it. There is no logical reason why three headed kurama avatar should be stronger than regular. We have the original naruto. Full power, so he has all his chakra. He then creates 2 clones. Thereby splitting his chakra into three(basics of shadow cloning). He then proceeds to combine all three avatars back into one. Do the math, what do you get? The same thing you started with.

The only reason why that avatar became on par with sasuke's is because naruto got delivered a lot of sage chakra from kurama. But before this, it's just a regular avatar with different look.

Not at all. Even after Naruto used up the Natural Energy on the TBBFRS, both the Ashura Avatar/Bijuu PS survived (varying) the stalemate of the blasts together.

 

[Holy God]

Not at all. Even after Naruto used up the Natural Energy on the TBBFRS, both the Ashura Avatar/Bijuu PS survived (varying) the stalemate of the blasts together.

Each avatar was destroyed by the blast, which is why they fell? If you meant it by that they still protected the two in the end, then yes, but you'd have to be assuming Naruto's regular cloak couldn't do that.

 

[lndra]

Each avatar was destroyed by the blast, which is why they fell? If you meant it by that they still protected the two in the end, then yes, but you'd have to be assuming Naruto's regular cloak couldn't do that.

Of course Naruto's cloak couldn't survive that, implying that Kurama's Avatar would have enough durability to survive that alone then we are joking around here.

Mind you, that the regular Kurama Avatar couldn't even create an Indra Arrow level attack without fusing together. The Natural Energy's purpose was for the TBBFRS.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

Not at all. Even after Naruto used up the Natural Energy on the TBBFRS, both the Ashura Avatar/Bijuu PS survived (varying) the stalemate of the blasts together.

But he would not have used all the sage chakra he gathered. As even Sasuke did not use all his bijuu chakra in that attack.

 

[lndra]

But he would not have used all the sage chakra he gathered. As even Sasuke did not use all his bijuu chakra in that attack.

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Where else would the NE go?

 

[Holy God]

Of course Naruto's cloak couldn't survive that, implying that Kurama's Avatar would have enough durability to survive that alone then we are joking around here.

Mind you, that the regular Kurama Avatar couldn't even create an Indra Arrow level attack without fusing together. The Natural Energy's purpose was for the TBBFRS.

Why wouldn't his regular avatar be able to survive? They both are using the same amount of chakra.

Sasuke only used Indra's Arrow once(unless you count the miniature arrows he shot as the same technique), so you cannot scale it to be higher than what the regular cloak does. You're comparing Naruto's attack level to one that hasn't been measured yet and is also then being measured to Naruto's two attacks. Essentially, it'd be measuring his attack with his own attack.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

Of course Naruto's cloak couldn't survive that, implying that Kurama's Avatar would have enough durability to survive that alone then we are joking around here.

Mind you, that the regular Kurama Avatar couldn't even create an Indra Arrow level attack without fusing together. The Natural Energy's purpose was for the TBBFRS.

It couldn't create it. Cuz that attack apparently needs 6 arms. Naruto could have simply sprouted 2 sets of arms from his normal avatar. But he had two clones nearby so i guess he thought why not.

 

[The Necromancer]

No really, think about it. There is no logical reason why three headed kurama avatar should be stronger than regular. We have the original naruto. Full power, so he has all his chakra. He then creates 2 clones. Thereby splitting his chakra into three(basics of shadow cloning). He then proceeds to combine all three avatars back into one. Do the math, what do you get? The same thing you started with.

The only reason why that avatar became on par with sasuke's is because naruto got delivered a lot of sage chakra from kurama. But before this, it's just a regular avatar with different look.

Not at all. Even after Naruto used up the Natural Energy on the TBBFRS, both the Ashura Avatar/Bijuu PS survived (varying) the stalemate of the blasts together.

I think I know the thought processes behind each of your answers.

URH: You believe that because the Shadow Clone Jutsu splits chakra equally, that logically when combined back together, the chakra potency should be the same. Which is understandable.

However, this is untrue, and please allow me to explain it with math.

Let's say for all intents and purposes, Naruto has 100 units of Chakra. Now let's say hypothetically the Kurama Avatar takes 20 Chakra to create and maintain. Now, you would be absolutely correct if the Kurama avatar took a percentage or even all of Naruto's chakra. But it doesn't. One Kurama avatar logically takes no more chakra to make than another Kurama Avatar.

Now, because Kurama's avatar takes a flat amount of chakra. "20 units out of 100," even when Naruto's chakra is split 3 ways, into 33 units, 33 units, and 33 units, it still takes 20 units of chakra to create the Kurama avatar. Now, instead of there being 3 sets of 20% of 33% of Naruto's total chakra, which would still equal 20% of his chakra, there are 60 units of chakra combined together.

Long story short, because jutsus take a flat amount of chakra, rather than a percentage of chakra, combining the jutsus of clones combine the power equally, which is why this worked.

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And wasn't only as powerful as 100% Naruto's Oodama Rasengan.

 

[lndra]

It couldn't create it. Cuz that attack apparently needs 6 arms. Naruto could have simply sprouted 2 sets of arms from his normal avatar. But he had two clones nearby so i guess he thought why not.

Incorrect. Naruto had clones who could create the attack for him, but instead he fused the avatars together. The logic is that simple.

Why wouldn't his regular avatar be able to survive? They both are using the same amount of chakra.

Sasuke only used Indra's Arrow once(unless you count the miniature arrows he shot as the same technique), so you cannot scale it to be higher than what the regular cloak does. You're comparing Naruto's attack level to one that hasn't been measured yet and is also then being measured to Naruto's two attacks. Essentially, it'd be measuring his attack with his own attack.

Why wouldn't a regular Perfect Susano'o survive?

The stalemate of their attacks combined was felt even by Kakashi/Sakura who were three countries away.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

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Where else would the NE go?

that doesn't say anything about naruto using all his chakra in that attack. It just says kurama was able to send sage energy to naruto on time.

 

[lndra]

I think I know the thought processes behind each of your answers.

URH: You believe that because the Shadow Clone Jutsu splits chakra equally, that logically when combined back together, the chakra potency should be the same. Which is understandable.

However, this is untrue, and please allow me to explain it with math.

Let's say for all intents and purposes, Naruto has 100 units of Chakra. Now let's say hypothetically the Kurama Avatar takes 20 Chakra to create and maintain. Now, you would be absolutely correct if the Kurama avatar took a percentage or even all of Naruto's chakra. But it doesn't. One Kurama avatar logically takes no more chakra to make than another Kurama Avatar.

Now, because Kurama's avatar takes a flat amount of chakra. "20 units out of 100," even when Naruto's chakra is split 3 ways, into 33 units, 33 units, and 33 units, it still takes 20 units of chakra to create the Kurama avatar. Now, instead of there being 3 sets of 20% of 33% of Naruto's total chakra, which would still equal 20% of his chakra, there are 60 units of chakra combined together.

Long story short, because jutsus take a flat amount of chakra, rather than a percentage of chakra, combining the jutsus of clones combine the power equally, which is why this worked.

Spoiler

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And wasn't only as powerful as 100% Naruto's Oodama Rasengan.

That's exactly what I believe, I don't know about the other guys.

that doesn't say anything about naruto using all his chakra in that attack. It just says kurama was able to send sage energy to naruto on time.

Use common sense.

Naruto creates the Ashura Avatar > Naruto asks Kurama where the NE is > Kurama clone disappears > NE arrives > Naruto creates the TBBFRS > Sends the attack

Look back at Kurama said, "If my Natural Energy would not have made it in time, you would have been blow away"

If Naruto never made his attack with NE/TBBFRS, he would have been destroyed. That and the fact that Ashura Avatar was created without the need for Kurama to gather NE moots any point there either. Basically, nada.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

Incorrect. Naruto had clones who could create the attack for him, but instead he fused the avatars together. The logic is that simple.


Why wouldn't a regular Perfect Susano'o survive?

The stalemate of their attacks combined was felt even by Kakashi/Sakura who were three countries away.

Indra, could you maybe explain to me how you think the combination of three thirds of a whole add up to more than the whole. cuz i don't get it. that would mean naruto ended up with more chakra than he started with. Which doesn't really make any sense to me.

 

[lndra]

Indra, could you maybe explain to me how you think the combination of three thirds of a whole add up to more than the whole. cuz i don't get it. that would mean naruto ended up with more chakra than he started with. Which doesn't really make any sense to me.

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Read that first, and if you don't understand his brief explanation. I'll give it a go.

 

[Holy God]

Why wouldn't a regular Perfect Susano'o survive?

The stalemate of their attacks combined was felt even by Kakashi/Sakura who were three countries away.

It wouldn't. No avatar made by Naruto or Sasuke could survive. The Three-Headed Kurama Avatar and Tailed Beast Susano'o only held up long enough for the explosion to pass them. Sasuke's Perfect Susano'o would do the same.

That doesn't sound surprising when you have the world's amount of natural energy collide with a lot of the tailed beasts' chakra.

 

[UchihasRightfulHeir]

I think I know the thought processes behind each of your answers.

URH: You believe that because the Shadow Clone Jutsu splits chakra equally, that logically when combined back together, the chakra potency should be the same. Which is understandable.

However, this is untrue, and please allow me to explain it with math.

Let's say for all intents and purposes, Naruto has 100 units of Chakra. Now let's say hypothetically the Kurama Avatar takes 20 Chakra to create and maintain. Now, you would be absolutely correct if the Kurama avatar took a percentage or even all of Naruto's chakra. But it doesn't. One Kurama avatar logically takes no more chakra to make than another Kurama Avatar.

Now, because Kurama's avatar takes a flat amount of chakra. "20 units out of 100," even when Naruto's chakra is split 3 ways, into 33 units, 33 units, and 33 units, it still takes 20 units of chakra to create the Kurama avatar. Now, instead of there being 3 sets of 20% of 33% of Naruto's total chakra, which would still equal 20% of his chakra, there are 60 units of chakra combined together.

Long story short, because jutsus take a flat amount of chakra, rather than a percentage of chakra, combining the jutsus of clones combine the power equally, which is why this worked.

Spoiler

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And wasn't only as powerful as 100% Naruto's Oodama Rasengan.

I'm not really sure I understand what you are trying to say. I am taking Kurama avatar to be an individual entity(basically naruto + kurama in one), as it performs the tech. So kurama avatar makes 2 clones and recombines them. So imagine kurama avatar was just naruto, explain how he makes clones of himself and recombines to be more powerful.

update: Never mind explaining. I understand where you are coming from. But your scenario only works if RSM naruto creates 2 clones and each of them then make kurama avatars. In that fight, it's the entire entity that is cloned.