Ay vs Might Guy
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Gai stomps, he is far stronger, faster, better in taijutsu and even more versatile with Asa Kujaku and Hiru Tora that serve as short, mid and long range attacks at the same time and also have AoE. Gai is also portrayed as a far superior ninja than the Raikage.
Yeah true,
No he doesnt,
7th gate guys speed and reflexes are above V2 Ays, as feats show, meainng that he ensures that Ay gets hit,
and when he does, he dies,
Guy managed to use hirudora against Juubi Jin madara, he is certainly using it against Ay, who is nowhere near his level
not to mention that 7th Gate Guys speed and reflexes are well above V2 Ays as shown with his performance against madara, whichh was better than even SM Minato, who is above Ay
With his superior speed and reflexes, as well as his superior taijutsu skills, he uses hirudora and Ay dies
KidGamer65
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Gai shits. He can match Ay's speed, and his reflexes, reaction speed, and striking speed take a fat ass dump on Ay's considering he was pushing back JJ Madara, while SM Minato failed to tag him, and SM Minato's speed>>V2 Ay's speed. Gai does him like he did Madara, only difference is Ay won't be back stepping, he'll be getting slapped around and then Hirudora finishes him off.
pateuvasiliu
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Honestly, I think 7 gates gai fighting Madara like that is big fat plot.
We're talking about the same guy ( pun intended ) that fought Kisame and could've pulled out that speed to beat him down rather easily.
Also Gai being faster than SM Minato is just mind boggling.
We're talking about the same guy ( pun intended ) that fought Kisame and could've pulled out that speed to beat him down rather easily.
Also Gai being faster than SM Minato is just mind boggling.
KidGamer65
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Gai one shotted him with Hirudora the moment he entered the 7th Gate, so that speed wasn't even necessary, not to mention Hirudora was faster, much faster than what you're suggesting.
pateuvasiliu
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It doesn't change the fact that Gai's been sitting on the power to blitz just about anyone in the universe for so many years.
Like when Orochimaru invaded Gai, with this power, could've demolished the whole invasion by himself.
KidGamer65
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pateuvasiliu
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That's my point.
Hiruzen's dying fighting Oro while Gai could go 7gates and literally murder everyone, including Gaara+Shukaku.
And you can't say he didn't have the gates back then because he had already trained Lee in how to open 5 of them.
The portrayal of Gai and Kakashi suggest these 2 were supposed to grow in pair with Kakashi majority of times having the advantage. In their childhood, Kakashi had the advantage. In part1, Gai implied he had the slight advantage. During this war, Gai implied however that Kakashi was always ahead of him in their battles.
And Kakashi admitted that 8 gated Gai surpassed him. And directly after that, Kakashi got his significant boost. Considering Kakashi had problems with his Sharingan in part1(to maintain it for long), it won't surprise me if part1 Gai couldn't use more than 5 gates especially when you look how shocked Kakashi was when he realised Lee could open that much at this age. Minato himself even said he never knew Gai could use gates(and the last time he saw Gai, he was 15 years old or so)
And Kakashi admitted that 8 gated Gai surpassed him. And directly after that, Kakashi got his significant boost. Considering Kakashi had problems with his Sharingan in part1(to maintain it for long), it won't surprise me if part1 Gai couldn't use more than 5 gates especially when you look how shocked Kakashi was when he realised Lee could open that much at this age. Minato himself even said he never knew Gai could use gates(and the last time he saw Gai, he was 15 years old or so)
Gai didn't use gates against Pain, Orochimaru, etc because of plot reasons.
I hold Ay to be overall superior to him in my book because Kisame tanked his best move and other things. Gais striking speed is certainly better but Ay can outlast his gates in my opinion.
I hold Ay to be overall superior to him in my book because Kisame tanked his best move and other things. Gais striking speed is certainly better but Ay can outlast his gates in my opinion.
How is he stronger? Aye was able to chop the horn of a Bijuu no diff, Break the Wood hand of a sage Buhda statute no diff, etc etc. I'm the biggest Guy fan on this site (before it was cool to support him), what strength feats does he have over Aye?
Faster? He is faster in Combat Speed yes, But in Pure Shunshin, no! V2 Aye Shunshin was able to literally dodge a last milli second attack no diff. In combat speed Guy>Aye, In Shunshin and evading Aye>Guy.
Versatility belongs to guy, But Morning Peacock is useless, and Hindura is avoided unless your saying it is faster then Amaterasu?
Gai with 8 gates is portrayed to be beyond All Kages ever shown, whats your point?
His speed may be on par, but Reflexes Def goes to Aye! Aye had the awareness to wait for Ama' then dodge it when it spawned on him (milli second). Guy Combat speed is def faster then Aye's, But Aye's Shunshin in evading makes sure he dodges every Attack like Hindora and MF. Guy's Hits will not hurt Aye, especially in his Lightning armor where he will fill no pain from the constant surge of adrenalin keeping his nerves on a go to go situation.
And how is a Attacking Minato (non shunshin) faster Then Aye? It would seem many ppl mix Combat speed with movement speed yet again.
And how is His reflexes above Aye again? Aye dodged ama last second, Blitz Rinnagan Madara with base V1 speed. Now he may not be the fastest, but he damn sure isn't slow in the reflex department. His Shunshin is nigh instant! Minato has never shown any speed close to his V2 speed feats. Only ninja who Shunshin was faster was Kcm Naruto who planned and prepped it getting ready to dodge.
I'm not saying he can match combat plus movement speed of Guy, but he def will be able to avoid the Hindura and fatal hits. Since he feels no pain with in the raiton armor, he will be able to keep shunshin'ing after standard blows. It's not as easy as you all make it seem.
How is hi sreflexes and reaction speed better? what Puts his Reaction speed and reflexes over the top with you all? I'm just Curious.
And What does SM Minato striking speed have to do with Aye's V2 Shunshin again? The blows From 7th gate is not hurting V2 Aye to the point he will just stand there, Hindora will be the only attack to harm him, and he can avoid it.
Forbidden Technique
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Base Minato had no problem reacting to Ay's fastest shunshin punch. Yet SM Minato couldn't react to Jubi Jin Madara in CQC and got destroyed, while exhausted 7G pushed that same Madara back 10-15 meters. Inb4 Ay has gotten faster since then; KCM Naruto reacted and avoided current Ay's V2 shunshin punch... but got bested in CQC by Obito and his clone couldn't react to a gunbai swing [
And I have no idea why people believe Ay can shunshin at the speed he used to avoid Amaterasu whenever he wants. Just like Sasuke had to charge up his chakra for several pages in order to use Amaterasu, so did the Raikage in order to shunshin that fast [
Gai shits.
>Doesn't need time to charge up his chakra to obtain his top speed
>Superior Reflexes
>Superior Striking Speed
>Superior Taijutsu skill
>Comparable Strength
>Far better destructive feats with Hirudora
>Good enough durability to take direct super-human punches without any notable damage
Ay doesn't stand a chance.
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]. Yet base Gai bested that same Obito in CQC and was more then capable of reacting to a gunbai swing in his blind spot [
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]. Though the real KCM Naruto was barely capable of defending himself from a gunbai
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, he was still getting overwhelmed. Without the gates, Gai's reflexes were up to par with
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. Ay isn't on that level, demonstrated multiple times in the manga.And I have no idea why people believe Ay can shunshin at the speed he used to avoid Amaterasu whenever he wants. Just like Sasuke had to charge up his chakra for several pages in order to use Amaterasu, so did the Raikage in order to shunshin that fast [
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], and it's only good for one single burst. So it's not like Ay will be shunshin'ing that fast throughout the fight, whereas Gai in 7G can continuously travel at around that speed, with the striking speed to even out match that. Gai shits.
>Doesn't need time to charge up his chakra to obtain his top speed
>Superior Reflexes
>Superior Striking Speed
>Superior Taijutsu skill
>Comparable Strength
>Far better destructive feats with Hirudora
>Good enough durability to take direct super-human punches without any notable damage
Ay doesn't stand a chance.
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Your first paragraph revealed you still dont know the difference between movement and fight speeds.
Your second one revealed you don't know the full mechanics of how Shunshin works.
As soon as the 7G comes out, Ay automatically loses Med diff only because I'm considering his title as a kage.
- Ay is regarded as the fastest Shinobi but that's only when it comes to moving from Point A to B. Gai far outclasses him when it comes to Striking and Reaction speed and also has the advantage in Taijutsu. Not to mention Ay movement from Point A to B surpasses Gai by a narrow margin if anything given the fact that Gai could move fast enough to get to Madara's position despite the Jin being able to sense. As you get closer or as someone gets closer to you, you sense them coming closer and closer
- Do I really need to explain to anyone what happened here?
Ay isn't winning jack. Not happening at all.
- Ay is regarded as the fastest Shinobi but that's only when it comes to moving from Point A to B. Gai far outclasses him when it comes to Striking and Reaction speed and also has the advantage in Taijutsu. Not to mention Ay movement from Point A to B surpasses Gai by a narrow margin if anything given the fact that Gai could move fast enough to get to Madara's position despite the Jin being able to sense. As you get closer or as someone gets closer to you, you sense them coming closer and closer
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and yet we have Gai leaving a sensor of such caliber surprised in the bottom left of the scan with Raw foot speed alone
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Flip to next page and you'd see Gai just got there in the top right before he started showing Striking and Reaction speed in the Middle panel. While Minato failed to surprise him with teleportation. Don't know why Gaara would be surprised at such Movements when he fought alongside Ay and saw him against Sasuke.- Do I really need to explain to anyone what happened here?
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Done it over and over again but Ay basically can't hit 7G Gai especially when KCM Naruto and Minato could react to his fastest punch. Gai's Striking speed>>>>Ay and the same goes for his reaction speed no argument and Gai could physically position for Hirudora before Madara could attack him in a physical confrontation and even fire it to the extent where Madara was surprised and was forced to stop the technique rather than evade it(Look back at the scan). Once it's a CQC, Heck no is Ay escaping that considering this guy's moves are mainly CQC based and Madara was forced to stop it rather than evade it.Ay isn't winning jack. Not happening at all.
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Forbidden Technique
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Movement speed is how fast you can move on foot. How fast you can get from point A to point B. Shunshin is an example of this.
Fight speed (hand speed/attack speed) is how fast one is able to attack/fight. This means how quickly one can react during a fight and how quickly and precisely you can attack a person.
We don't get to see fight speed much until two shinobi go at it in CQC and since we don't see that much anymore, many people just think a persons movement speed = their fight speed. I'll use your KCM Naruto point in this example.
>KCM Naruto evaded Ays V2 Shunshin with his own Shunshin. That is a display of their movement speeds.
>You say KCM was bested by Obito in CQC and couldn't react, where as Gai did.
>They were in an actual CQC fight where as Ay and Naruto weren't.
>All this proves is that KCM Narutos fight speed is not fast (or at least faster than some others) but his movement speed is.
Its not an easy thing to grasp and thats mostly because we don't get many CQC fights (when real shinobi fought back in part 1 Lol) anymore because now people just blow up battlefields. Think of it this way, a race between two shinobi would go differently than a taijutsu fight between them because movement and fight speed are different.
KidGamer65
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Minato's reactions>Ay's reactions. Minato got cut down by JJ Madara, despite him using Sage Mode. Gai engaged that same Madara, and instead of getting cut down, Gai pushes him back, thus Gai is faster.
If he can push back JJ Madara, and has better reflexes than someone with better reflexes than Ay, Ay won't be able to blitz anyone here, nor is he even faster to begin with. Even if he was, it's not by much, and then we have the fact that Gai can move at his top speed continuously while Ay has to charge his V2 Shunshin.
Hurt him? Maybe not. Push him back? Yes. If he uses Hirudora in close quarters just how he did against JJ Madara, there is no avoiding it. All he can do from there is die.