Technically if we apply real science then hiruzen won't have any problems with acidic mist. All he needs is suiton, because when you add water to acid the acid is neutralized. So if hiruzen uses suiton on the mist he should be able to neutralize it. Without her acidic mist Mei loses this battle.
[VS] Mei VS Old Hiruzen
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KidGamer65
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Good point about the speed, but Hiruzen has Fuuton. Since Mei won't be filling up this entire area anytime soon due to its size, all he needs to do is use Fuuton to blow whatever she's firing at him away, and while he's doing that he can make 2 Shadow Clones so he can follow up with everything else I stated in my first post.
Hydrolysis applies mainly to the dissociation of basic acids composed of hydrogen protons and some anions; Mei's mist - more acidic than potent gastric acids - would release heat when combined with water (or any base, in fact) and proceed to boil at an even higher velocity and concentration. You had it almost correct, however; inorganic acids tend to dissociate inside a solvent to produce a diluted solution when the solvent is in greater quantity than itself.
If that's the case then as KG suggested, futon should be able to remove the mist. Since it only takes one seal for him to use a fuuton stream I don't see timing being a issue.
If hiruzen starts the battle by dropping a smoke bomb it will give him enough time to summon clones to aid him.
If hiruzen starts the battle by dropping a smoke bomb it will give him enough time to summon clones to aid him.
Keyboard Uchiha
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Seriously? Mei neg to low diffs him...
Old Hiruzen is inferior to Mei in every single thing.
Coming close to Mei isn't even an option, when she can easily use her Futton Spit or Lava Globes, which she can fire off like 7-8 in ~0.5 sec.
Moreover, you're massively overrating OLD Hiruzen. His stamina is terrible and chakra reserves laughable. Even without clones all he could do was to throw some irrelevant Katon and Doton. If Futton somehow doesn't end this, Mei's massive Water Dragons are overkill. Especially since she's shown her control over them and their movement. Even though Doton has elemental advantage, it won't help Hiruzen if it's times weaker than Mei's Suiton. Mei traps Hiruzen in her Water Dragon like she did to Madara and either pushes him into the ground killing him with pressure or pushes him into the barrier which sets everyone who touches it on some magical fire
There's literally NO way of Hiruzen winning this. He cannot burn her since she's resistant. He cannot crush her or break her bones since she's resistant to it somehow as well. Using clones is a death sentence for OLD Hiruzen and due to chakra reserves his jutsu are inferior.
@Edit.
Sorry for lack of scans, but I'm on some old pc right now and it takes ages to even browse the manga. But if something is unclear, I'll take my time
Old Hiruzen is inferior to Mei in every single thing.
Filling up an area with her Futton takes splits of a second. Moreover, her Futton was shown to be useable at
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as well.Coming close to Mei isn't even an option, when she can easily use her Futton Spit or Lava Globes, which she can fire off like 7-8 in ~0.5 sec.
Moreover, you're massively overrating OLD Hiruzen. His stamina is terrible and chakra reserves laughable. Even without clones all he could do was to throw some irrelevant Katon and Doton. If Futton somehow doesn't end this, Mei's massive Water Dragons are overkill. Especially since she's shown her control over them and their movement. Even though Doton has elemental advantage, it won't help Hiruzen if it's times weaker than Mei's Suiton. Mei traps Hiruzen in her Water Dragon like she did to Madara and either pushes him into the ground killing him with pressure or pushes him into the barrier which sets everyone who touches it on some magical fire
There's literally NO way of Hiruzen winning this. He cannot burn her since she's resistant. He cannot crush her or break her bones since she's resistant to it somehow as well. Using clones is a death sentence for OLD Hiruzen and due to chakra reserves his jutsu are inferior.
@Edit.
Sorry for lack of scans, but I'm on some old pc right now and it takes ages to even browse the manga. But if something is unclear, I'll take my time
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KidGamer65
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It took her that long to fill up the hallway her and Sasuke were in, and that isn't as large as the area she is fighting Hiruzen in, nor do you know how far away she was when she used her jutsu to melt that hand, so its nigh irrelevant.
He doesn't need to come close to annihilate her. Though I'm curios as to where you got the underlined part from.
Wrong.Moreover, you're massively overrating OLD Hiruzen. His stamina is terrible and chakra reserves laughable. Even without clones all he could do was to throw some irrelevant Katon and Doton. If Futton somehow doesn't end this, Mei's massive Water Dragons are overkill. Especially since she's shown her control over them and their movement. Even though Doton has elemental advantage, it won't help Hiruzen if it's times weaker than Mei's Suiton. Mei traps Hiruzen in her Water Dragon like she did to Madara and either pushes him into the ground killing him with pressure or pushes him into the barrier which sets everyone who touches it on some magical fire
Edos have the same chakra capacity as they did when alive. Hiruzen made 5 clones, and used large elemental jutsu all at the same time. I have no reason to believe that Alive Hiruzen can't do the same thing, though it'd probably cost a lot of chakra. That's why I've only said he'll use 1 clone, and his elemental jutsu. If I'm overrating him, then the manga is as well since that is where I'm getting his capabilities from. Lol.
Acid Mist won't end anything. If she uses it, he blows it back and a clone counter attacks with an element, preferably Doton. Mei's jutsu are impressive, but they aren't anything that Hiruzen can't already handle. Not only does he have the size advantage, he has the elemental advantage as Doton>Suiton. So her Suiton jutsu are easily countered. So why should I believe Mei's jutsu are stronger? Where do you even get that from? Lol.
Lol, what? Mei isn't resistant to being burnt. That's only her own Acid. Hiruzen's Katon fries her if he hits her. Mei isn't resistant to getting crushed either. If Hiruzen uses Doton and it smashes her against the ground or the barrier, she's done for. She only survived Shinsuusenju's single hit and Susanoo's single hit because they didn't smash her against anything else. Take a hammer and hit an apple mid air, then smash the apple against the wall using the hammer. The latter will hurt the apple, much worse.
Hiruzen already used 5 clones and still had enough chakra for large elemental jutsu. No reason to believe he can't use at least 1 here, and where do you get Mei's jutsu being superior from? Hiruzen has the size advantage, and he has the elemental advantage. If their jutsu clash, Mei's gets wrecked.
Seriously? Mei neg to low diffs him...
Old Hiruzen is inferior to Mei in every single thing.
Filling up an area with her Futton takes splits of a second. Moreover, her Futton was shown to be useable atYou must be registered for see linksas well.
Coming close to Mei isn't even an option, when she can easily use her Futton Spit or Lava Globes, which she can fire off like 7-8 in ~0.5 sec.
Moreover, you're massively overrating OLD Hiruzen. His stamina is terrible and chakra reserves laughable. Even without clones all he could do was to throw some irrelevant Katon and Doton. If Futton somehow doesn't end this, Mei's massive Water Dragons are overkill. Especially since she's shown her control over them and their movement. Even though Doton has elemental advantage, it won't help Hiruzen if it's times weaker than Mei's Suiton. Mei traps Hiruzen in her Water Dragon like she did to Madara and either pushes him into the ground killing him with pressure or pushes him into the barrier which sets everyone who touches it on some magical fire
There's literally NO way of Hiruzen winning this. He cannot burn her since she's resistant. He cannot crush her or break her bones since she's resistant to it somehow as well. Using clones is a death sentence for OLD Hiruzen and due to chakra reserves his jutsu are inferior.
@Edit.
Sorry for lack of scans, but I'm on some old pc right now and it takes ages to even browse the manga. But if something is unclear, I'll take my time
Everything I bolded is incorrect.
1. Hiruzen is superior to Mei in taijutsu, Intelligence, shuriken jutsu, Bukijutsu, and is arguably faster than Mei.
2. His stamina far exceeds the realm of "terrible". He clearly was able to battle with orochimaru for the better par of an hour without any signs of over-exhaustion. His chakra reserves are only laughable compaired to his prime, but according to kishimoto's databook hiruzen has just as much stamina as kakashi. They both have 3's in terms of stamina and/or chakra reserves. Hiruzen has shown the ability not only create 5 shadow clones (multi kage bushin) but have each one use a gigantic A (possibly S) ranked elemental stream to counter a thousand armed buddah that was powered by hashirama's cells. He was able to accomplish this and hiruzen as a edo (according to tobirama) is still not a full power, which means if he was alive could accomplished more.
Also, hiruzen is said to have perfect chakra control only needing to use minimum amount of chakra to use his techniques which saves him a lot of chakra.
3. Hiruzen has stronger chakra than Mei, which was shown when he released it and began cracking the roof he was standing on against Orochimaru. These are feats only seen with tobirama and hashirama. With Hiruzen having stronger chakra I don't see why his doton wouldn't easily be able to counter her suiton.
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4. What makes you say that she cant be crushed??
5. Once again he at an old age has stamina equal to kakashi, and he has already been shown to make 5 clones at once. In his battle with orochimaru it was said that it would be a waste of chakra for hiruzen to send out shadow clones because he doesn't have the reserves that he once had where he could just spam clones for no reasons. He just would be wasting chakra which wouldn't be a smart thing to do in a battle against 3 hokage level shinobi.
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Prince Charles
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Through counter balancing and Neutralizing the respective natures she uses. Deidara's KKG was weak to and neutralized by Sasukes lightning because it was fire plus earth and earth is weak to lightning. KKG's still hold the properties of their original elements. Boil style is neutralized by Earth blast and element strong against water but not weak to fire. Her Lava style is neutralized by Hiruzen lightning blast, an element strong versus earth but not weak to fire.
Hiruzen literally counters her so easy this is a stomp thread. Enma solo's easy. Hiruzen could also one shot her with all elements with clones. She stands no chance.
In the scan I posted you can clearly see that Susanoo that hit Mei had to jump to her (look at its leg). In time it hit her, its hand was almost completely melted. The distance and melting speed is impressive, like it or not.
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Firstly, since Hiruzen has no knowledge of Futton, after she'd used it, Hiruzen's clones wouldn't even get any time to react since a single stab makes clones poof. Continuous damage from every angle affecting whole body is more than enough to render clones useless.
Moreover, I don't know how Edo Bodies exactly work, since Kishi messed up on this part, but Hiruzen clearly got a chakra boost in his Edo body. Orochimaru was surprised Hiruzen rushed at him without Kage Bunshin but
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by an Anbu member. The only reason Hiruzen used his Kage Bunshin was because he knew he was going to suicide, so chakra was
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anymore.You are wrong. Mei is resistant to acid and lava. She lets it drip from her mouth on her skin. And no, ninja aren't immune to their own jutsu. Look at Deidara running from his own bombs for example. Moreover, Sasuke example of using his Raiton on his own body is often brought up. But it's false. Sasuke's own Raiton
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him.So it's not that Mei is resistant to her techniques only, since no one is. By some unknown means, her body is resistant to very high temperatures and corrosion. And about smashing, a better example is a car hitting a human
But in this case we have something much heavier and much stronger than a car. Yet Mei survived without a single broken bone. It's another thing that wasn't explained in manga, but her body is also very durable. I don't care why - it simply is.Clones argument was already covered.
There is no way to counter the mist. You cant make it disappear as it all trapped in the barrier. And thats even if he has to ability to do anything once he is in the mist and its burning him.
Deidara's clay was of the earth element which is why Sasuke's lightning countered it.
The mist is different and wont be countered easily.
There is no way to counter the mist. You cant make it disappear as it all trapped in the barrier. And thats even if he has to ability to do anything once he is in the mist and its burning him.
Deidara's clay was of the earth element which is why Sasuke's lightning countered it.
The mist is different and wont be countered easily.
Its not invisible man.
There is a way to counter everything. Earth is strong versus water because earth is made of water and the earth absorbs the water to the point it becomes muddy and drying it up. When the water properties of her boil style meet Hiruzens earth style the earth will absorb the water that keeps the attack in a vapor/gas like form and it is neutralized and no more.