Hiruzens new "feat" makes madara look like ass.

[Xēnovia.]

Oh~this thread could get juicy....I better pull out my chair and some nachos.​

 

[Souji]

you haven't countered anything i said, you're all fanfiction.

Hiruzen defeated the senju bro's because:

less than half powered
Were zombie's being controlled
Edo tensei Restricted their maximum potential

Tobirama close to full power babyshakes hiruzen.

And no, i don't hate hiruzen.

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you haven't countered anything, so i guess you got nothing?

Sorry, should I spell it out for you?

Tobirama also has unlimited chakra and a regenerating body. All of his feats he's shown are only possible if he's an Edo, yes? That's what you're saying about Hiruzen, so why shouldn't it apply to Tobirama as well?

Scans of Alive Tobirama feats? Oh, there are none...

Minato proved that using FTG on large objects multiple times causes fatigue, when he teleported Kurama away from Konoha.

 

[Flawž]

Sorry, should I spell it out for you?

Tobirama also has unlimited chakra and a regenerating body. All of his feats he's shown are only possible if he's an Edo, yes? That's what you're saying about Hiruzen, so why shouldn't it apply to Tobirama as well?

Scans of Alive Tobirama feats? Oh, there are none...

Minato proved that using FTG on large objects multiple times causes fatigue, when he teleported Kurama away from Konoha.

Yes but Tobirama is a senju when alive, He has Senju chakra reserves meaning hes more likely to do all that Alive than hiruzen who is an Old man when alive.

Tobirama alive = Senju Reserves

Hiruzen Alive = Average cakra reserves

You compared the wrong guy my friend.

 

[Souji]

Yes but Tobirama is a senju when alive, He has Senju chakra reserves meaning hes more likely to do all that Alive than hiruzen who is an Old man when alive.

Tobirama alive = Senju Reserves

Hiruzen Alive = Average cakra reserves

You compared the wrong guy my friend.

@bold ok, so you're allowed to speculate and hype Tobirama's capability but we Hiruzen fans aren't?

Them double standards.

 

[Flawž]

@bold ok, so you're allowed to speculate and hype Tobirama's capability but we Hiruzen fans aren't?

Them double standards.

Are you dumb? Really.

Senju reserves vs Average reserves


How is that speculating.

 

[xcoyote]

Hiruzen>the poor man's Minardo

 

[Souji]

Are you dumb? Really.

Senju reserves vs Average reserves


How is that speculating.

You must not read your own posts. You said, and I quote, " ...hes more likely to do all that Alive...".

The phrase "more likely", implies that you are not knowledgeable of what he was capable of in his Alive form. So what he did, AS AN EDO, vs. Juubito and whatnot would have been possible if he was alive? You are speculating his Senju capabilities, I see no feats from him as an Alive Tobirama other than slashing Izuna and sensing.

Hiruzen's chakra levels were lower than in his youth, that's a fact. But this point is irrelevant to the topic, what you're essentially saying is that Tobirama is capable of performing his Edo feats if he was alive, due to his reserves. But Hiruzen is incapable of doing so because his Edo feats don't apply to his alive self.

^that right there, is some real sound logic.

And I'd ask you stop insulting my intelligence, because I don't do that to you.

 

[startup97]

You must not read your own posts. You said, and I quote, " ...hes more likely to do all that Alive...".

The phrase "more likely", implies that you are not knowledgeable of what he was capable of in his Alive form. So what he did, AS AN EDO, vs. Juubito and whatnot would have been possible if he was alive? You are speculating his Senju capabilities, I see no feats from him as an Alive Tobirama other than slashing Izuna and sensing.

Hiruzen's chakra levels were lower than in his youth, that's a fact. But this point is irrelevant to the topic, what you're essentially saying is that Tobirama is capable of performing his Edo feats if he was alive, due to his reserves. But Hiruzen is incapable of doing so because his Edo feats don't apply to his alive self.

^that right there, is some real sound logic.

And I'd ask you stop insulting my intelligence, because I don't do that to you.

He can't counter it...

 

[Flawž]

You must not read your own posts. You said, and I quote, " ...hes more likely to do all that Alive...".

The phrase "more likely", implies that you are not knowledgeable of what he was capable of in his Alive form. So what he did, AS AN EDO, vs. Juubito and whatnot would have been possible if he was alive? You are speculating his Senju capabilities, I see no feats from him as an Alive Tobirama other than slashing Izuna and sensing.

Hiruzen's chakra levels were lower than in his youth, that's a fact. But this point is irrelevant to the topic, what you're essentially saying is that Tobirama is capable of performing his Edo feats if he was alive, due to his reserves. But Hiruzen is incapable of doing so because his Edo feats don't apply to his alive self.

^that right there, is some real sound logic.

And I'd ask you stop insulting my intelligence, because I don't do that to you.

Everything You wrote is irrlevent.

i'll make this as easy as possible for you to understand, Stay with me buddy.

Tobirama = Senju Reserves, brother of hashirama.

Hiruzen = Old man = Chakra reserves below average

Tobirama could in fact do all these things he did alive because all he did throughout the war was use FTG, kage bunshin and Held up the Barrier and combated the shinju. His feats are plausible for him to accomplish when he was alive because he has senju level chakra, FTG was shown to be used with ease as shown by minato.

Now hiruzen on the other hand doesn't have the chakra reserves to hold up a barrier, Throw a few shuirkens, Combat the shinju and make 5 clones enabling them to use an element each. That's Something only edo Hiruzen can do. Because as i repeat, Old hiruzen (alive) barely made 3 clones, Edo hiruzen made. Now you do the math.

 

[Souji]

Everything You wrote is irrlevent.

i'll make this as easy as possible for you to understand, Stay with me buddy.

Tobirama = Senju Reserves, brother of hashirama.

Hiruzen = Old man = Chakra reserves below average

Tobirama could in fact do all these things he did alive because all he did throughout the war was use FTG, kage bunshin and Held up the Barrier and combated the shinju. His feats are plausible for him to accomplish when he was alive because he has senju level chakra, FTG was shown to be used with ease as shown by minato.

Now hiruzen on the other hand doesn't have the chakra reserves to hold up a barrier, Throw a few shuirkens, Combat the shinju and make 5 clones enabling them to use an element each. That's Something only edo Hiruzen can do. Because as i repeat, Old hiruzen (alive) barely made 3 clones, Edo hiruzen made. Now you do the math.

An Edo Tensei is brought back in the same state as the subject is at the time of their death. Manga fact.

Hiruzen was fully capable of his Edo feats if he was alive. Once again, you're allowing Tobirama those capabilities (when he haven't seen any Alive feats other than what I've listed), apply to him, SIMPLY ON THE BASIS of "Senju Reserves", but suddenly Hiruzen can't have the same feats if he was alive? The heck?

Ever hear of power scaling? Plus, Hiruzen had no killing intent against Orochimaru, until towards the end of the fight.

Stop applying a double standard.

 

[Flawž]

An Edo Tensei is brought back in the same state as the subject is at the time of their death. Manga fact.

Hiruzen was fully capable of his Edo feats if he was alive. Once again, you're allowing Tobirama those capabilities (when he haven't seen any Alive feats other than what I've listed), apply to him, SIMPLY ON THE BASIS of "Senju Reserves", but suddenly Hiruzen can't have the same feats if he was alive? The heck?

Ever hear of power scaling? Plus, Hiruzen had no killing intent against Orochimaru, until towards the end of the fight.

Stop applying a double standard.

wait a minute, your applying that Old man hiruzen can do everything he did As an edo?

 

[Souji]

wait a minute, your applying that Old man hiruzen can do everything he did As an edo?

Gee, they're the same person. The only difference is the unlimited chakra and regeneration, lol. Chakra levels are the same.

Wait a minute, you're implying that Tobirama can do everything he did as An Edo?

 

[startup97]

Souji Vs. KingFlawz on PPV tonight!!!

 

[Flawž]

Gee, they're the same person. The only difference is the unlimited chakra and regeneration, lol. Chakra levels are the same.

Wait a minute, you're implying that Tobirama can do everything he did as An Edo?

No im asking you,

What bases do you base this fact on that Hiruzen can do what he did as an edo? I know the chakra reserves don't change, but the fact that chakra refills means Edo's fight much longer than they would Alive.

So Do you believe Old man Hiruzen can do all the things he did when he was an edo? Remember that he barely could pull off 3 clones when he was alive, and effortlessly made 5 clones even after fighting the war for awhile?

I'd love this hear this.

 

[Penguin]

I wouldn't **** with Souji. >_>

Hiruzen>the poor man's Minardo

Lol what? The only thing Minato has on Tobirama are prepped kunai.

 

[LegendaryAce]

Gee, they're the same person. The only difference is the unlimited chakra and regeneration, lol. Chakra levels are the same.

Wait a minute, you're implying that Tobirama can do everything he did as An Edo?

Hiruzen could probably summon 5 clones but the difference is as an edo it regenerates fast so he doesnt have to worry about it too much, i am sure hiruzen would die if he tried doing everything he did alive (old hiruzen) as hiruzen was the professor i am sure he knew this, i mean 3 clones and he was tired and having a hard time 5 of them on top of that make them use large scale attacks would be too much for him.

hiruzen couldn't do the feats he did as an edo while alive, btw orochimaru also didnt have any intentions of killing hiruzen until he noticed him trying to seal his edos + his hands, as we all have watched the fight orochimaru was messing around with hiruzen to psychologically torture him knowing that hiruzen couldn't kill him.

 

[Souji]

No im asking you,

What bases do you base this fact on that Hiruzen can do what he did as an edo? I know the chakra reserves don't change, but the fact that chakra refills means Edo's fight much longer than they would Alive.

So Do you believe Old man Hiruzen can do all the things he did when he was an edo? Remember that he barely could pull off 3 clones when he was alive, and effortlessly made 5 clones even after fighting the war for awhile?

I'd love this hear this.

Yes, he is capable of pulling that off.

Here, since we agree on at least ONE thing, let's put it logically together.

Assume that Hiruzen and Edo Hiruzen both have a base 100 chakra. Then, let's assume that the technique he pulled off requires 90 chakra.

That would leave Hiruzen and Edo Hiruzen both with 10 chakra left. Edo Hiruzen's chakra would regenerate far faster than Alive Hiruzen's. The latter would have to wait a while, take a food pill, etc. before he could do something like that again. Therefore, he is capable of performing the feat.

This is an example of both a power scale and a retcon. Hiruzen was appropriately power scaled for part 2, and his feats were retconned and adjusted effectively.

They are the SAME ENTITY and are therefore capable of the SAME FEATS. Prove me otherwise, not using the clone argument. Every character was power scaled from the timeskip. Simple as that.

 

[Murasame]

Damn Flawz fled the thread Lol

 

[Xlad]

About the Edo Tensei and unlimited chakra. I'm pretty sure that unlimited chakra comes from infinite regeneration.

 

[Penguin]

No one ****s with Souji. ._.