For you Obito haters

[Murasame]

Lately I've been seeing people say he is the worst villain ever or I've seen them say he is a pedophile and the question is how? Show me scans where he has sexual thoughts about Rin because I've never seen them. Show me scans where he complains about Rin all the time? Really it's getting old, you guys are over exaggerating the whole "Rin Rin Rin" thing and its dumb.

Now Obito's reason to become a villain is Rin right? Correct? Yes indeed. Is it the only reason? No not all. They live in a ninja world so they run the risk of dying.. so put yourselves in Obito's spot. How would you react to seeing your love interest or at least someone who was dear to you used by someone else for their personal gain? Not only that but to see your best friend who swore to protect her kill her? Some of you would get revenge others would not but Obito did and after killing people in cold blood he was not the same person anymore and I doubt many of you would be too. If it isn't bad enough he is an Uchiha who are very emotional people, more than the normal person.

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To make things worse he was also manipulated by Uchiha Madara who fed him stories of creating a world where there would be peace and no tragedies that would occur like what happened to him. Now a lot of you call bull crap on Obito using Rin as his motivation to break Madara's will over him and also using it to become the Jubi's jinchuriki. Besides that he also thought about Kakashi and Minato so I don't see anything wrong with that.Why you ask? Well love can give you the strength and drive to make you do things you wouldn't do on your own.. this translates to fiction and real life in many ways if you really think about it. The death of a dear has strengthened the reslove of many characters in show.. This has been a point shown throughout the story whether its' good or bad so why mostly hate on Obito?
Obito's reason to become the way he is because of Rin not start the war because of her.

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Obito's reason to become the way he is because of Rin not start the war because of her

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If he was really complaining why doesn't he blame Kakashi?

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The point is he just wants to create his ideal world and that is the reason he started the war.. Rin made him evil not start the war. Just see the scans below.
These all support my previous arguments.

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So to conclude this Rin's death was a reason but it was also because of the System and Cruel World... that is what Obito wanted to change so tragedies such as what happened to him would never occur again. Obito turned out the way he was because of Rin and started the war not because of Rin but to create his ideal world. That is what people fail to grasp.

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This is Obito's message to you

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If you don't like his character that is fine we have our opinions but don't hate on him for the wrong things you don't understand fully U_U

edit: I'll add this to my op.. keep in mind I did change some of my views but still go with what I said.. the following is my counter to what most people would question about Obito.

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Now if anyone says Obito perverses over Rin, they are clearly being illogical. Don't pay any mind to those types of people because they are helping neither side. However, the more sane members who have complaints about Obito, do have a point. He doesn't bring Rin up as much the "haters" (I don't like using that word) say he does, but he does bring her up more than your average villain. One of the members in my thread noted that other villains do the same, but that is not so. Allow me to explain:

Member's viewpoint: Would Nagato have become Pain if Yahiko didn't die? Would Oro have become who he is if his parents didn't die? Would Madara have left Konoha had Izuna not die? You could use that logic for every villain.

My response: The only difference is, they don't start a world war over it. It caused their start of darkness, but their villainy doesn't revolve around it. Nor do they feel the need to bring it up, or reference it, every time they engage in battle. Besides, all those villains you listed, we didn't find out what caused their villainy until someone else brought it up. With Obito, he simply doesn't shut up about it.
Okay let me correct you on this.. Nagato didn't start a World War because he didn't live up until that point.. if Naruto hadn't talked some sense into him he would be involved in this war as much as Obito. Like I said earlier in the thread Rin's death started his descent to the darkside like yahiko's death to Nagato. Both their deaths showed them how cruel the ninja world and system was.. both were warned beforehand and both shook it off up until that point. Nagato went on a murder spree like Obito went on a murder spree and once they committed those acts they weren't the same person they were before. Obito had Madara take advantage of his state of mind while Obito did the same exact thing to Nagato. Now okay you say Obito makes references to Rin but who eggs him on it? Kakashi and Minato both people who were acquainted with him. Pain did reference Yahiko as well against Jiraiya and again with Naruto.. so I don't see the problem when they're called out on it especially Obito. I agree with you on Orochimaru.. he's a bad example to use because we don't know much about his past. As for Madara it was his whole plan in the beginning! Anyways reread the Madara flashback.. he did state his reasons.. he turned out the way he did because he failed to protect his brothers and because he doesn't want to fail to protect the clan. The reason he doesn't mention it a lot is because he doesn't have people who closely acquainted in the current generation who want to know his motives.. Hashirama knows already so I don't see any reason for him to state it unless asked.

I understand where you are coming from with that, Uchiha are very emotional, but despite Madara losing someone even closer to him than in Obito's case, he was far less drastic. Someone said something similar to this when they stated that Madara never got over Izuna, so Obito shouldn't be completely hated.

Well everyone is not the same on the emotional level.. some people can break down easier than others and the same logic can apply to Uchiha's.. take Itachi for example he had to wipe out ALL his clan members and his parents as well. He had it the worst arguably compared to everyone else.. yet he was different from other Uchihas. Obito was also a young kid/early teen.. Madara was born in a time where war was constant and the world wasn't as civilized as it was during Obito's time. Madara was pushed into war even while young and was trained for it so of course his emotions will be hardened unlike Obito. People have to take these things into consideration before judging that not everyone is the same.

His words: And as I recall Madara didn't get over Izuna's death, he tried to destroy Konoha countless times before he was stopped by Hashirama.

My response: But like I said, does he ever bring it up? Did you ever hear Madara currently whine about Izuna's death verbatim? You didn't find out about it until Obito and Hashirama told you, am I right? Is Madara talking about it now? Is Madara making references about his death now? Is Madara starting a world war over it? No. I thought not. And for your information, Madara did get over Izuna's death. It wasn't until Tobirama decided to speak against making him Hokage, when he finally decided that he would never be trusted and that his clan would be subjugated, that he snapped and left Konoha for good. He was perfectly fine with trusting Hashirama's ideals until that event.
As I said Obito doesn't whine about it.. this is the problem most members fail to comprehend. He is getting egged on by Kakashi and Minato who want know why he turned out this way so what do you expect? Madara didn't have anyone question him about his motives so why would he say anything to people who don't anything about personal past life? You expect to tell them story time when there is a war going on? The ones who were acquainted with him already knew (Hashirama and Tobirama) so he didn't have to get questioned about it unlike Obito who his past friend and Sensei had no knowledge of his motives. Madara was going to start a war on it as well but he was incapable of doing it so he passed his task onto Obito.
Not quite @bold before leaving the village he makes mention as to why he's going on his own path.. what you say is correct but he also said it's because he failed to protect his brothers.

You see where I'm getting at? Obito never got over Rin's death. And what makes it worse is when he acts like he's the only one affected by it. My question is, what about Kakashi?
Show me a scan that implies or states it. You're incorrect with the rest of your post as he knows that Kakashi is affected as well. He even tries to persuade him to join his side.

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This is my viewpoint on Kakashi: Rin's death is hurting Kakashi more than Obito and Obito's actions are only making him feel worse. Not only because of Rin, but because it hurts that he couldn't save his best friend, now to watch his best friend turn evil ... there honestly is no words. I commend Kakashi for staying strong. Kakashi had just as much reason as Obito to start a World War, but he didn't. He's affected just as much, but he doesn't let that get to him. That's one of the reasons why people don't like Obito is because he makes Rin the focal point of his plan.
The thing is Kakashi isn't as emotional as Uchihas as I stated.. not to mention he didn't have someone like Madara manipulate him. Kakashi had people like Minato and other teammates like Gai, Asuma, Shizune, Kurenai, etc. to be there for him.. Obito didn't have that luxury. Minato even said himself he could've probably saved Obito if had realized. If you still go against this then we might as well criticize Nagato as well. Anyways where does he state or infer that Rin is the focal point?

When it comes to Madara's manipulation, I had a debate with someone about the same thing, and here are my viewpoints on that:

His viewpoints: Madara was the one who pulled the trigger & twisted his ideals, he didnt decide to wage war all by himself, lol.

My response: Obito's goal isn't larger. Yes you raise a point in how Madara twisted his ideals, but think of it this way, Madara gave his plans more depth. Without it, it would fully revolve around Rin. Sasuke is similar in that case. Also, think about all the Rin flashbacks he's had. Even if a situation had nothing to do with Rin, he'd find a way to make it about her, as the latest chapter shows. Also, take note how he didn't go through with Madara's plan because of what? His thoughts about Rin. Unlike the other villains, he can't seem to let that go. That is many people's issue here.
No no no absolutely no. There is more to it than someone he cared about dying.. do you not look past it? Rin's death was made as a way to open his eyes to the real world not the world he idealized. If it had been Kakashi he would've been the same.. sure he might've loved Rin but Kakashi was someone who was so important that he'd risk his life for him and would give his eye too. Anyways I've already countered the rin mentioning above and below... latest chapter was because Minato tried to lecture him not to mention Obito was probably trying to destroy Minato's will as well. Did you seem to forget that Madara betrayed him as well? Madara even said in the chapter that he used him. What do you expect him to do? Give up when he's so close? No just no.

His viewpoints: Naruto also went berserk & fell to his darkness due to kurama's influence, if minato wasnt there to comfort him then kurama would've taken over. Same concept with obito, if minato was there to comfort him instead of madara then there is absolutely no way that he would be the way he is, therefore rin isnot the reason for his defection but rather the influence caused by madara who pushed obito & gave him all the resources he needed.

My response: Remember that his team thought he was dead. Considering the injury, we can't blame them. Madara could have persuaded him ad infinitum, but if he felt that Rin should rest in peace, they would all be for naught. Also, one can't influence someone to do something that they never cared or had any intentions to do. The thought of Rin had to be in Obito's mind for Madara's manipulation to have been effective. Think of it like this, I could convince you to hurt yourself all I want, but if you don;t want to do it, I won't have any success in getting you to.
No incorrect.. it's not just Rin! Look I'll give you the link to reread the chapters again.. start from here

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and stop here

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If you read everything carefully then this debate should be over. You'll see its both about Rin and changing the fate of the world.. these are both points he's made during the war but people only pay attention to the "Rin" part. He also thinks of Kakashi as well during the flashback also Minato and his parents other people.. he eve says that in his world that Rin and Kakashi will be there.. the last image I posted below supports that claim.
His viewpoints: Dont forget that madara is around a decade old, obito was 14, madara knows of the uchiha's emotional state, & teenagers can be easily influenced. These are all factors that you must consider otherwise you are just hating as I said earlier .

My response: That's true but heed what I said before, if Obito didn't have the thought in his mind, nothing Madara would have done would have worked. Also, remember that Madara was elderly and would die soon, therefore ending his influence. Even as Madara passed and no longer could manipulate him, Obito still continued his plan. When Madara was revived and he was confronted, he still continued on. Now this time it's on him.
This post was countered for the most part with my other points above and below


Here's the thing, people would be more inclined to believe that is he wasn't near constantly bringing her up and referencing her. It'snot his plan that's annoying, it's how he is going about it. If anything, I'd say it's bad characterisation on Kishimoto's part.
It can be partly due to that but also mostly because its bad interpretation from people.. its not like he's bringing Rin up on his own.. he is getting egged on by Kakashi and Minato and when he does do it on his own is because he uses it to get past through situations like Madara attempting to control him and to control the Jubi.

This is his motivation

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Seeing as how he used it to overpower the jubi. This is what he wants again in his dream world.. its not all about Rin as you people think.

The majority of people didn't pay close attention to the flashbacks or didn't take closer looks.. if people took a closer look this wouldn't happen!

edit: lets say your right though well my opinion won't change on Obito.. I'm going to be a loyal fan. . besides there is still the point of him being an emotional uchiha who turn bad to due loss of love.

 

[itachi4real]

F*** a obito with his sentimental ass...crying over a ***** and overreacted

 

[Murasame]

Yeah, don't we have a thread for this exact discussion?

EDIT: Here we go:

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You obviously didn't read as both our threads are different.

Btw didnt read just to let u know

Ok cool reported for spam multiple times

 

[Raekwon26]

You obviously didn't read as both our threads are different.

Ok cool reported for spam multiple times

Not really.

That thread was about why do people hate Obito and it slowly turned into the people arguing about the problems with his character and other's arguing that he isn't doing this just for Rin and that the Uchiha love too much. Oh, and how he apparently wants to change the shinobi system. Yeah, right.

Something that is the main premise of your argument...

 

[Raekwon26]

Also, your poll options dude.

You expect for anyone to want to even discuss this with you with options like that?

Come on now.

 

[oShux]

You are only making things worst. As much as I like Obito the Rin thing is dumb as hell I wouldn't have started a whole war for a girl who didn't even notice I existed.

 

[Henrik]

Let them hate. In the end he will just finish their favorite characters.

 

[Fodder#4]

Obito, though carried heavily by Tobi. Which is understandable, most of the acts were commited as Tobi; Is one of the top three Villains in the series. He, Pein, and Orochimaru all fill similar but not exactly the same niches. And they fill them perfectly. He's a good villain. But, he lately has been iffy..

Again; Some people don't always enjoy the crying and emotional stuff. They just wanna see him fuck shit up. If you DO look into his character, a tad, you'll see he is a well written character. Not the best, but better then most.

 

[HiddenSound]

Compared to Orochimaru and Pain and (imo) Kabuto, Obito is a terrible villain imo. However, does this make him a terrible villain overall? Not at all. I still prefer him to Madara.
Btw, Tobi > Obito. Just Saiyan.

 

[Uzumaki Sasuke]

I couldn't have posted it any better way. Obito Rules

 

[Murasame]

Not really.

That thread was about why do people hate Obito and it slowly turned into the people arguing about the problems with his character and other's arguing that he isn't doing this just for Rin and that the Uchiha love too much. Oh, and how he apparently wants to change the shinobi system. Yeah, right.

Something that is the main premise of your argument...

Also, your poll options dude.

You expect for anyone to want to even discuss this with you with options like that?

Come on now.

The last option is the only bad one. Right but that wasn't the OP's main point was it? That was all of the members mentioning that and I decided to elaborate on it.. eveything I provided is information and proof not my viewpoint on a character.

You are only making things worst. As much as I like Obito the Rin thing is dumb as hell I wouldn't have started a whole war for a girl who didn't even notice I existed.

For an Obito fan you didn't read did you? Because you wouldn't state what you did if had read..

 

[Raekwon26]

The last option is the only bad one. Right but that wasn't the OP's main point was it? That was all of the members mentioning that and I decided to elaborate on it.. eveything I provided is information and proof not my viewpoint on a character.

The last option is probably the most important option because it's the option that could lead to people wanting to debate the topic with you. You haven't really given anyone that option and that's why people are making it a joke thread.

The main point was that , yes Rin is a catalyst but it's not his only reasons. However, people keep seeing that every time things get a little tough or he's faced with a harsh reality, Rin pops up and he gets way too over emotional.

I dislike him for many more reasons than just that, but that seems to be the main premise of why many dislike his character.

 

[Murasame]

Compared to Orochimaru and Pain and (imo) Kabuto, Obito is a terrible villain imo. However, does this make him a terrible villain overall? Not at all. I still prefer him to Madara.
Btw, Tobi > Obito. Just Saiyan.

We have our opinions and I respect yours... but I'm glad you realize he isn't as terrible as people make him out to be.. I'm not saying Obito is the best villain or anything of that sort but thanks for the feedback

I couldn't have posted it any better way. Obito Rules

Thank you and yes indeed he is.

 

[Bijuu Bomber]

Your points are valid and you wrote a good post so I won't troll.

Obito to me though is a badly written character though, even though it was the "system" that made him start this war, the fact that this was all originated from Rin's death is just bad, no matter if Kakashi killed her or anything else.

Him "loving" Rin who basically ignored him for Kakashi and really didn't notice him but her dying caused him for some reason to do all this even Invading the Leaf, causing the deaths of many, and other things is utterly selfish and a bad way to turn a character evil.

Not to mention he is thinking of not only Rin but his team is ok, but his reasons alone for going along with Project Tsuki-No-Me is terrible. "The Rin who died was a fake and so is this world" scenario is just....stupid beyond belief, he can't grasp reality and takes things to the extreme as it wasn't the world he wanted it to be. Thus trying to control others and make it his reality..

I'm not even mad that it was revealed it was Obito under the mask, so I'm not hating on him because he wasn't who I wanted him to be undernthe mask, as long as it was a brilliant back story and had valid reasons on why he's doing these things, but then....this happened..

Like I said earlier you wrote a good post that was well written so I respect all claims you make, but Kishi ruined all things I had with Tobi/Obito as a whole...

 

[Murasame]

The last option is probably the most important option because it's the option that could lead to people wanting to debate the topic with you. You haven't really given anyone that option and that's why people are making it a joke thread.

The main point was that , yes Rin is a catalyst but it's not his only reasons. However, people keep seeing that every time things get a little tough or he's faced with a harsh reality, Rin pops up and he gets way too over emotional.

I dislike him for many more reasons than just that, but that seems to be the main premise of why many dislike his character.

Well a Mod took care of it so it really doesn't concern me anymore.

Anyways you can dislike him if you want I don't mind but don't hate/dislike for the wrong reasons you don't understand or grasp.. that is my mesage to people.

He doesn't get over emotional as you like to think.. Obito got rid of his feelings.. refer to that "void in his heart" from previous chapters. Like I said in my OP there is nothing wrong with using a person you cared about as motivation.. Naruto has used Sakura or friends to get him through challenges so why not Obito? This type of thing has been a point throughout the series so why hate on it with Obito?

Your points are valid and you wrote a good post so I won't troll.

Obito to me though is a badly written character though, even though it was the "system" that made him start this war, the fact that this was all originated from Rin's death is just bad, no matter if Kakashi killed her or anything else.

Him "loving" Rin who basically ignored him for Kakashi and really didn't notice him but her dying caused him for some reason to do all this even Invading the Leaf, causing the deaths of many, and other things is utterly selfish and a bad way to turn a character evil.

Not to mention he is thinking of not only Rin but his team is ok, but his reasons alone for going along with Project Tsuki-No-Me is terrible. "The Rin who died was a fake and so is this world" scenario is just....stupid beyond belief, he can't grasp reality and takes things to the extreme as it wasn't the world he wanted it to be. Thus trying to control others and make it his reality..

I'm not even mad that it was revealed it was Obito under the mask, so I'm not hating on him because he wasn't who I wanted him to be undernthe mask, as long as it was a brilliant back story and had valid reasons on why he's doing these things, but then....this happened..

Like I said earlier you wrote a good post that was well written so I respect all claims you make, but Kishi ruined all things I had with Tobi/Obito as a whole...

I'm glad you didn't troll but did you read the whole thing or just skimmed it because some of the arguments you make is already countered above in the OP.

 

[Trollasaur]

I will admit the Rin flashbacks get anoying, and I wish they would stop.

But it's clear to me that he didn't start the war for a 14 year old girl. If he wanted to fornicate with her, he would of done so ages ago, he has had MANY chances to revive her.

 

[Bijuu Bomber]

I'm glad you didn't troll but did you read the whole thing or just skimmed it because some of the arguments you make is already countered above in the OP.

I read it all, but you can tell me what parts are countered if you'd like.

 

[Flawž]

Agreed, Obito haters stay mad.

 

[Murasame]

I read it all, but you can tell me what parts are countered if you'd like.

Obito to me though is a badly written character though, even though it was the "system" that made him start this war, the fact that this was all originated from Rin's death is just bad, no matter if Kakashi killed her or anything else.

Explain how losing someone dear to you is bad. Please do so.. especially if he was a Uchiha. Not only that he wasn't the same after killing the people who caused this and no one would be atleast most people. Put yourself in that situation.. he lost his sanity in his events so Madara took advantage of it.

Him "loving" Rin who basically ignored him for Kakashi and really didn't notice him but her dying caused him for some reason to do all this even Invading the Leaf, causing the deaths of many, and other things is utterly selfish and a bad way to turn a character evil.
Read above and it doesn't matter if she ignored or didn't reply to his declaration of love she still cared about him and so did he despite knowing she loved Kakashi. Thats all that matters.. He turned evil because of Rin but the rest of his motivation was to create his ideal world.. thats why he attacked the leaf and started the war.. as Obito stated he doesn't blame this useless reality. He doesn't care about the real world so why would he not do all of what he did?

Not to mention he is thinking of not only Rin but his team is ok, but his reasons alone for going along with Project Tsuki-No-Me is terrible. "The Rin who died was a fake and so is this world" scenario is just....stupid beyond belief, he can't grasp reality and takes things to the extreme as it wasn't the world he wanted it to be. Thus trying to control others and make it his reality..

Like I said he lost his Sanity.. he's crazy now so idk why you're saying this.. isn't this what evil characters are supposed to do? Like I said Uchiha's are highly emotional which is why he is the way he is.


Like I said earlier you wrote a good post that was well written so I respect all claims you make, but Kishi ruined all things I had with Tobi/Obito as a whole...[/QUOTE]

 

[scorezor]

dude , first of all , if you know the theory of tobidara , then you should just stfu with these stuff of obito being a sentimental b!tch lol , because he is a b!tch and he will forever be a b!tch because is a b!tch , b!tch and b!tch ,dude , all in all i think that sakura is even better than obito in being a character lol , look at sakura: sakura got almost his head handed to her by sasuke like what... 2 times? i don't remember , he lost sasuke to the darkness , naruto couldn't save him , kakashi was late also , and sakura dind't turned evil which was the thing that obito did lol , dude , i get it , his reason of turning evil was because of rin , good for him , i don't give a shit lol , but he still keeps saying "RIN RIN RIN RIN RIN" his motivation for his plan and for this war was because of rin , he did all of this because of rin , because he couldn't accept the fact that PEOPLE DIE! dude imagine , my best friend dies in front of me because of an accident , what can i do? i can go ape shit or just accept it ... "it's okay , it was an accident " that would be cool if the people only could accept it and not going ape shit , so if what obito said it's true: "that the ones who betray his friend are worse than scum" or something like that , then why he betrayied his friends , kakashi , HIS VILLAGE? LOL , i answer you that: because of tobidara.