What Evidence Do We Have That Suggest Yata Mirror Is Not Invincible?

[Jusanbi]

So wait, you apply this statement



To Yata Mirror, but Raikiri can't follow the same ruling?

Raikiri's DB entry has not been disproven. Raikiri was not stating to have certain conditions in which it will not "cut" Yata has not deflected elemental based attacks. Stop being a hypocrite, the same logic you're using for Yata can be used for Raikiri

Yata Mirror and Susano'o managed to stop Kirin, a lightning based attack using true natural lightning rather than chakra manifested.

 

[ToruneNamikaze]

I was appealing to you all. I believe it tanks all attacks.

Madara never said anything about the Hell Stab? What's your point?

He does not know about the Hell Stab meaning he claiming that the Yata Mirror can repel all attack is possibly false since Raikiri, Kabutowari, Kamui, and also Hell Stab have been stated to cut throught anything/break any defence/inescapable/ strongest weapon.

I am not saying the Yata Mirror isn't anything special but the sources of it's hype isn't exactly reliable. Madara isn't omniscient, how could he possibly know that Rasengan which was created after he died can be tanked by the Yata Mirror(not saying it can't) or jutsus he doesn't know of like possibly Hell Stab.
The Databook is filled with hyperbolas and exaggeration that contradict the manga or other things stated in the databook for example Kamui and Raikiri and Amaterasu.

 

[Booker]

He does not know about the Hell Stab meaning he claiming that the Yata Mirror can repel all attack is possibly false since Raikiri, Kabutowari, Kamui, and also Hell Stab have been stated to cut throught anything/break any defence/inescapable/ strongest weapon.

I am not saying the Yata Mirror isn't anything special but the sources of it's hype isn't exactly reliable. Madara isn't omniscient, how could he possible know that Rasengan which was created after he died can be tanked by the Yata Mirror(not saying it can't) or jutsus he doesn't know of like possibly Hell Stab.
The Databook is filled with hyperbolas and exaggeration that contradict the manga or other things stated in the databook for example Kamui and Raikiri and Amaterasu.

Raikiri, Hell Stabs, etc., hype is ridiculous.

Yata Mirror's is not ridiculous.

 

[fastrthnwind]

OMG not this again :|

 

[ToruneNamikaze]

Raikiri, Hell Stabs, etc., hype is ridiculous.

Yata Mirror's is not ridiculous.

XD So you get to decide which hype to believe and which not?

 

[HadouKage]

Are you a dumbass? They are in the EXACT same situation.

Both are featless compared to their hype. However, due to the fact Yata Mirror is an ancient spiritual, magical weapon, and the fact a character as knowledgable as Madara stated it's invincible, Yata Mirror has more credibility to it's hype than Raikiri.

So I'm a dumbass, do I need to provide with manga scans that backup my statement????? :|
You have helped me prove my statement saying that it pierced, ANYTHING can be applied in what you said as well, how has anything you said refuted Raikiri's statement? The difference between me and you is that I have manga proof while you keep speculating. It doesn't matter what you state; YOU HAVE LITERALLY ZERO MANGA FACTS TO BACK UP THE DB STATEMENT ABOUT DEFLECTING ELEMENTAL ATTACKS. Your bold statement is just inferring something that hasn't been feated in the manga because it is "ancient and spiritual"

 

[kakashi ms]

Your point?

Yata Mirror was created by Kishimoto after Raikiri, so Yata > Raikiri

Kamui is debatable for me. It all depends on if Kamui can go through things (I.E. through Susano'o)

yes it can go through things as it is s/t jutus and depends on concentrating by mind as databook say
kakashi was able to warp hatchibi although he was in kuarma cloak ,the cloak didn't block kamui(so susanu or yata can't block kamui too)
kakashi can even warp the yata itself ,it can't defend against jutus would made it in other dimesnion

 

[Booker]

So I'm a dumbass, do I need to provide with manga scans that backup my statement????? :|
You have helped me prove my statement saying that it pierced what it has ANYTHING can be used in what you said as well, how has anything you said refuted Raikiri's statement? The difference between me and you is that I have manga proof while you keep speculating. It doesn't matter what you state; YOU HAVE LITERALLY ZERO MANGA FACTS TO BACK UP THE DB STATEMENT ABOUT DEFLECTING ELEMENTAL ATTACKS. Your bold statement is just inferring something that hasn't been feated in the manga because it is "ancient and spiritual"

I am willing to believe an ancient spiritual weapon (probably created by the Sage) can tank a hit from a mediocre shinobi's lightning hand.

Did you not see the scan of Yata Mirror tanking 6 Giant Striking Snakes?

 

[kakashi ms]

where was yata when itachi was absorbed by nagato's chibaku tensi ?
where was yata when itachi was affected by tauya's sound ginjutsu ?
where was yata when itachi was affected by kabuto's light and sound jutus ?

why yata didn't make this jutus lose its meaning?
do you know why yata wasn't able to counter all that? i know
that is because all of these attacks is untouchable(light,sound,gravity)so kamui as them ,it is untouchable jutus
untouchable attacks>yata

databook said that kakshi's kamui is unmatched and no defense can counter it

Spoiler

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kishi here was talking about old kakashi's kamui ,what about current kakashi's kamui which doesn't need to be gathered for ,and can warp objects instantly without even sharingan notices

kakashi can even warp itachi while he is inside susano without warping any part of susano as kamui depend on concentrating by mind (kakashi was able to warp hatchibi although he was in kuarma's cloak,kuarma's cloak didn't block kamui)
yata protect one side only any destructive attack that can affect susano ,can affect itachi's susano from the baack(hiudora,dust,bijudoma,giant bijudoma...etc)
there are no evidence say yata can protect all susano
why people don't want to answer my post ?
i suggest that because they can't argue me

 

[HadouKage]

I am willing to believe an ancient spiritual weapon (probably created by the Sage) can tank a hit from a mediocre shinobi's lightning hand.

Did you not see the scan of Yata Mirror tanking 6 Giant Striking Snakes?

Jesus Christ, who's clutching straws now?
You're a contradictory hypocrite adjusting the DB statements to his own predilection and it's quite sickening. What does 6 snakes have to do with elemental affinities?

Kakashi (partially withstood) BT
BT > 6 snakes

What's your point?

 

[Booker]

Jesus Christ, who's clutching straws now?
You're a contradictory hypocrite adjusting the DB statements to his own predilection and it's quite sickening. What does 6 snakes have to do with elemental affinities?

Kakashi (partially withstood) BT
BT > 6 snakes

What's your point?

BT?... What's that?

I'll just keep letting you talk. You're making yourself look like an idiot just fine, trying to suggest Raikiri > Yata Mirror.

 

[HadouKage]

BT?... What's that?

I'll just keep letting you talk. You're making yourself look like an idiot just fine, trying to suggest Raikiri > Yata Mirror.

Basho Tenin
Fallacy
All I'm doing is presenting you with your logic, this is a hypothetical situation because of the constant nonsense I hear from you and other members (especially fanboys). Yet you are using no manga feats to back up your statement. Seems you have nothing to refute carry on then U_U

 

[Booker]

Basho Tenin
Fallacy
All I'm doing is presenting you with your logic, this is a hypothetical situations because of the constant nonsense I hear from you and other members (especially fanboys). Yet you are using no manga feats to back up your statement. Seems you have nothing to refute carry on then U_U

You've lost all credibility you might have had on this site stating Raikiri > Yata Mirror.

It's just common sense otherwise.

 

[HadouKage]

You've lost all credibility you might have had on this site stating Raikiri > Yata Mirror.

It's just common sense otherwise.

Yet you have zero manga evidence to refute my claim :|
And when I said ">" I was referring to cutting

 

[HadouKage]

There is something called deductive reasoning and basic common sense... utilizing it to discern the difference between outright hyperboles and factual statements is a necessity in debating

What facts in the manga has shown Yata reflecting elemental attacks?

 

[Owarij]

What facts in the manga has shown Yata reflecting elemental attacks?

]What does that have to do with anything? It has reflected all physical and material attacks thrown at it

2/4 things stated in the databook that it could deflect

 

[HadouKage]

]What does that have to do with anything? It has reflected all physical and material attacks thrown at it

2/4 things stated in the databook that it could deflect

Doesn't answer my question
It has no manga feats of reflecting elemental attacks nor will it ever so you cannot infer that it can

Raikiri has lived up to it's DB statement yet you infer Yata can reflect when it hasn't reflected any elemental based attacks in the manga?
Nice logic :|

 

[Owarij]

Doesn't answer my question
It has no manga feats of reflecting elemental attacks so you cannot infer that

Raikiri has lived up to it's DB statement yet you infer Yata can reflect when it hasn't reflected any elemental based attacks in the manga?
Nice logic :|

??
Back to the topic of using common sense and deductive reasoning


Kakashi has implied in the manga that basic rasengan can kill someone
Yet in the manga thus far it hasn't

does that mean that since it hasn't so far it's incapable of doing such a thing?

don't be ridiculous, that logic will get you no where in naruto, the inference that a proposition stating yata can deflect elemental attacks or rasengan can kill is false from the fact that neither of which have been proven to be true or known to be true is a complete and utter logical fallacy ....Although most arguments involve claims that its premises provide evidence directly correlating with the truth of its conclusion, only deductive reasoning involves a claim that its premise requires CONCLUSIVE proof... In cases like these, with yata mirror and rasengan require more inductive arguments, not that the premises give conclusive evidence , but that they provide SOME evidence for it, with inductive reasoning the validity of the argument would be decided based on the overall likelihood and probability of the conclusion ...

As a debater, you're supposed to use BOTH inductive and deductive reasoning when developing and formulating arguments..

We can sit here all day and argue about hard core fact... but once again, I draw you back to my original proposition , that you utilize common sense in your arguments.. taking in all other factors .. for eg, the fact that Sasuke's "chidori", simply a less concentrated form of raikiri , failed to fully cut through the raikage's armour

 

[Exaar]

Databook claims
Kumai: You cannot defend against it, no matter what

Manga claims
One of the 7 Swords mens sword breaks Any and all defenses

Databook claims
Kakashi's raikiri can cut Anything

It's a hyperbole the same as the statements i just said. While i Agree it most likely can deflect most attacks a "normal" shinobi can use.

But when you take it out of "shinobi" realms such as Mountain busters, Juubi and so on it gets kinda hard to believe.

...Madara's will might as well be Madara. Same difference..

No it's not.

Madara has susanoo, So he must have Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi according to the databook. Yet zetsu said "We might finally get to see amaterasu". Now why would Zetsu (madara as you like to call him) be so keen to see a jutsu he already knows about and has seen?.

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

Absence of proof isn't proof? You're using that in the wrong context. Yata's lack of feats is not proof of it's invincibility.

The databook also implied a potential weakness. It said that Yata changes it's properties to negate a single attack, it says nothing of multiple attacks. If one's a fuuton and the other's taijutsu, then it can only stop one.

Besides, the shield itself may or may not be invincible, but it can't save it's user from everything. Just look at Captain America, he's gifted with an invincible shield but that doesn't make himself invincible.

Black Zetsu is not Madara, it's his will.

Indeed.

The fact that hyperboles are ever present in the Databook and that other things are stated to destroy everything.


Amaterasu's flames are as hot as the sun.

Madara's Susano'o is said to destroy all creation.

This is true.

Gaara's sand is stated as the ultimate defense, does that make it > Yata Mirror?

"Every Jutsu Has A Weakness"
-Itachi

Thus Yata Mirror has to have a limit.

This is something everyone needs to remember when trying to argue no-limit fallacies.