Naruto Meeting The Sage: The Unstated Implications!

NaruSasuRival

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Hey guys, and welcome to a picture-less thread. If you like logical thinking, you will probably contribute to this. If you are one of those kids who only say what sound good to him, there is certainly a lot of chance you will hate this. Then, if you hate the fact that Naruto is very special bloodline-wise, then don't even bother reading this. Given these restrictions, here is the theory.

I. Reasons why many people think Naruto will meet the SO6P

The first basis for this argument is Minato's sealing jutsus in which he can make an event-driven trigger that allowed him to appear in Naruto when he opened the seal. If we discount all the inconsistencies shown by Kishi, many people believe Rikudo did something similar with the Bijus so that he can appears upon some conditions.

The second basis basis for the theory is the presence of all the Bijus in Naruto, which the proponents of the theory believe will trigger Rikudo's appearance because Rikudo place his chakra in all Bijus in a way that when the chakra are together, it will trigger is appearance.

II. Let dig into the theory!

II.1 The reunion of all Biju's chakra is certainly not the Key of Rikudo's appearance if he had to appear!

This makes sense if logic is considered. If placing all the bijus together can cause Rikudo to appear, why did Rikudo not appears in Obito or Madara. Clearly both of them had all the chakra of all the Bijus. Thus, if the key to Rikudo's appearance is the reunion of all Bijus chakra, then Rikudo should have appeared at least to Obito.

Thus, if Rikudo has to appear inside Naruto, there must be another Key that neither Madara, nor Obito had.

II.2. Acknowledgement by all the Bijus may be the key!

Well, as demonstrated above, there has to be a major key that must trigger Rikudo's appearance if it has to happen. Otherwise, Rikudo would have appeared inside Obito and Madara. One possible key is that all the bijus must agree with the candidate.

If this is the case, how can some seal determine that the Bijus agree unanimously with someone? I understand that Kishi is a magician, but if agreement with the host is involved, then there have to be a cognizant process to determine that the Bijus agree with the host before the seal can open. In fact, I think that in this case, the bijus will be the one to do the magic so that Rikudo can appear. But here, another problem appears:

Should all the Bijus be present or should only a few of them do the magic? Can Rikudo really do such thing based on the mere appreciation of some Bijus who have been frustrated all their lives? If this is the case, is there any possibility for a genjutsus to force them to open the seal, and cancel the plan?

Well, I said this is logical thinking. In my opinion, if Rikudo has to appears, and if we admit that it is a short appearance that can appear only once, then Rikudo will have to use a foolproof method. That is a method that is genjutsu-safe, or coercion-safe. This lead me to the following:

1. The Biju can only give intel about Rikudo to someone they like.
2. They can teach some techniques of Rikudo to someone they like
3. However, they cannot be the only key if Rikudo need to make a short appearance. This would be risky!

Thus, I think if Rikudo will appear then it is something of a godly realm that in which Naruto's own chakra is a final key.

II.3. Naruto's bloodline or a hidden power within Naruto has to be the true key for Rikudo's appearance!

Again, I am trying to make sense of the theory. If Rikudo has to appears, the method used has to be a foolproof method that anyone else cannot alter. The only way to do that is for the chosen person to be a key himself, through a hidden power, or a rare bloodline that appears once in a millenium.

However, this methods is actually of a god, and means that Rikudo will not be necessary, then. If a child that is born many thousand here after the death of a certain man has a key connected to that man, then there is no reason to bring that old man. Thus, I believe that Rikudo's appearance will be unecessary waste of page as I defend this conclusion next.

III. Why is there no need for Rikudo to appear?

I think it is simple to see it, and asking for it is purely a request of fanservice. The key to understand it is that actually, Naruto is already special. Look at the following:

1. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has his will
2. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has already started to distribute chakra to connect people just like Rikudo
3. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has tamed all the biju through his method of understanding
4. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has already gained the respect of almost 99.9% of the shinobi.
5. Naruto already know he is the chosen child, and has already chosen his path
6. Naruto is already having all Bijus power

This facts make Rikudo appearance useless. I mean what are the possible things Rikudo can add to Naruto? Give him Jutsus? Tell him his life story? Tell him how to defeat Madara? What?

Well, I am waiting for people to answer these question. As far as I am concerned, I think the following:

Naruto is truly Rikudo reincarnated!

IV. A reincarnated sage!

Well, this is the conclusion. Unlike what people are predicting, I think all the various prophecies and hints given by Kishi are going to start to fulfill.

1. Naruto's mother as a mirror of Kaguya Otsuki aka Kushina Uzumaki with special chakra (we knows all special chakra have Origin with Shinju)
2. Naruto born of a female Jinchuriki just like Rikudo was born of Kaguya
3. Naruto unlocking a seal that turned the badass Kyuubi into a pet when he took Yang chakra
4. Naruto being acknowledge by the Bijus as someone the sage predicted
5. Naruto having the will, method, and recently sharing chakra just like the Rikudo Sennin

All this things tell me a single thing when he takes all Bijus' chakra?

Just like his seal mutate with only Kyuubi's chakra, and he started to grow trees on Zetsus, Naruto will unlock a new power that will turn him into a new Rikudo Sennin.

In my opinion, this is what has been hinted by the entire series. Naruto is the new Rikudo Sennin by himself. The old sage is dead and he will not come. Naruto does not have the consciousness of all the Bijus right now, only Kyuubi's trace of chakra of most of the other Bijus.

Basically, the reason Kyuubi was tied to Naruto, and the reason he keep having Kyuubi's appearance is that Kyuuubi is the essence of Juubi. It is the same thing that was in the fruit Kaguya ate. This is why Naruto is an exact copy of Rikudo Sennin. You say why? Here is the answer and the only picture in this threads:

You must be registered for see images

According to Mito, Kyuubi is a guardian of the world. This means that the Jinchuriki of Kyuubi will have some kind of power or role to keep the world stable. It suggest that Kyuubi will let someone use his power only if that person is special in the stability of the world.

In fact, just like Rinnegan appears in time of great change, Kyuubi was said to appears when human hatred has reach a certain level.
 

Flakez

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Good read. Though I still think that Rikudou will appear, but other than that... nice thread.
 

Hori

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According to Mito, Kyuubi is a guardian of the world. This means that the Jinchuriki of Kyuubi will have some kind of power or role to keep the world stable. It suggest that Kyuubi will let someone use his power only if that person is special in the stability of the world.

In fact, just like Rinnegan appears in time of great change, Kyuubi was said to appears when human hatred has reach a certain level.

Wow amazing thread impressive, probably the best I have seen today, thumbs up :win:

Now tell me when and where did Mito say Kyuubi was the Guardian of the world? For starters the Kyuubi hates humans... most humans inhabit the world, and surely it doesn't care about the world or humans.

On a serious note what if Naruto has already met Rikudou in the other world as how Kakashi was able to see his father as seeing that he was dead? That would shove your whole theory to the drain
 
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Narutoga

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good thread, but am still expecting our famous rikuduo sennin
 

iNotorious

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Hey guys, and welcome to a picture-less thread. If you like logical thinking, you will probably contribute to this. If you are one of those kids who only say what sound good to him, there is certainly a lot of chance you will hate this. Then, if you hate the fact that Naruto is very special bloodline-wise, then don't even bother reading this. Given these restrictions, here is the theory.

I. Reasons why many people think Naruto will meet the SO6P

The first basis for this argument is Minato's sealing jutsus in which he can make an event-driven trigger that allowed him to appear in Naruto when he opened the seal. If we discount all the inconsistencies shown by Kishi, many people believe Rikudo did something similar with the Bijus so that he can appears upon some conditions.

The second basis basis for the theory is the presence of all the Bijus in Naruto, which the proponents of the theory believe will trigger Rikudo's appearance because Rikudo place his chakra in all Bijus in a way that when the chakra are together, it will trigger is appearance.

II. Let dig into the theory!

II.1 The reunion of all Biju's chakra is certainly not the Key of Rikudo's appearance if he had to appear!

This makes sense if logic is considered. If placing all the bijus together can cause Rikudo to appear, why did Rikudo not appears in Obito or Madara. Clearly both of them had all the chakra of all the Bijus. Thus, if the key to Rikudo's appearance is the reunion of all Bijus chakra, then Rikudo should have appeared at least to Obito.

Thus, if Rikudo has to appear inside Naruto, there must be another Key that neither Madara, nor Obito had.

II.2. Acknowledgement by all the Bijus may be the key!

Well, as demonstrated above, there has to be a major key that must trigger Rikudo's appearance if it has to happen. Otherwise, Rikudo would have appeared inside Obito and Madara. One possible key is that all the bijus must agree with the candidate.

If this is the case, how can some seal determine that the Bijus agree unanimously with someone? I understand that Kishi is a magician, but if agreement with the host is involved, then there have to be a cognizant process to determine that the Bijus agree with the host before the seal can open. In fact, I think that in this case, the bijus will be the one to do the magic so that Rikudo can appear. But here, another problem appears:

Should all the Bijus be present or should only a few of them do the magic? Can Rikudo really do such thing based on the mere appreciation of some Bijus who have been frustrated all their lives? If this is the case, is there any possibility for a genjutsus to force them to open the seal, and cancel the plan?

Well, I said this is logical thinking. In my opinion, if Rikudo has to appears, and if we admit that it is a short appearance that can appear only once, then Rikudo will have to use a foolproof method. That is a method that is genjutsu-safe, or coercion-safe. This lead me to the following:

1. The Biju can only give intel about Rikudo to someone they like.
2. They can teach some techniques of Rikudo to someone they like
3. However, they cannot be the only key if Rikudo need to make a short appearance. This would be risky!

Thus, I think if Rikudo will appear then it is something of a godly realm that in which Naruto's own chakra is a final key.

II.3. Naruto's bloodline or a hidden power within Naruto has to be the true key for Rikudo's appearance!

Again, I am trying to make sense of the theory. If Rikudo has to appears, the method used has to be a foolproof method that anyone else cannot alter. The only way to do that is for the chosen person to be a key himself, through a hidden power, or a rare bloodline that appears once in a millenium.

However, this methods is actually of a god, and means that Rikudo will not be necessary, then. If a child that is born many thousand here after the death of a certain man has a key connected to that man, then there is no reason to bring that old man. Thus, I believe that Rikudo's appearance will be unecessary waste of page as I defend this conclusion next.

III. Why is there no need for Rikudo to appear?

I think it is simple to see it, and asking for it is purely a request of fanservice. The key to understand it is that actually, Naruto is already special. Look at the following:

1. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has his will
2. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has already started to distribute chakra to connect people just like Rikudo
3. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has tamed all the biju through his method of understanding
4. Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has already gained the respect of almost 99.9% of the shinobi.
5. Naruto already know he is the chosen child, and has already chosen his path
6. Naruto is already having all Bijus power

This facts make Rikudo appearance useless. I mean what are the possible things Rikudo can add to Naruto? Give him Jutsus? Tell him his life story? Tell him how to defeat Madara? What?

Well, I am waiting for people to answer these question. As far as I am concerned, I think the following:

Naruto is truly Rikudo reincarnated!

IV. A reincarnated sage!

Well, this is the conclusion. Unlike what people are predicting, I think all the various prophecies and hints given by Kishi are going to start to fulfill.

1. Naruto's mother as a mirror of Kaguya Otsuki aka Kushina Uzumaki with special chakra (we knows all special chakra have Origin with Shinju)
2. Naruto born of a female Jinchuriki just like Rikudo was born of Kaguya
3. Naruto unlocking a seal that turned the badass Kyuubi into a pet when he took Yang chakra
4. Naruto being acknowledge by the Bijus as someone the sage predicted
5. Naruto having the will, method, and recently sharing chakra just like the Rikudo Sennin

All this things tell me a single thing when he takes all Bijus' chakra?

Just like his seal mutate with only Kyuubi's chakra, and he started to grow trees on Zetsus, Naruto will unlock a new power that will turn him into a new Rikudo Sennin.

In my opinion, this is what has been hinted by the entire series. Naruto is the new Rikudo Sennin by himself. The old sage is dead and he will not come. Naruto does not have the consciousness of all the Bijus right now, only Kyuubi's trace of chakra of most of the other Bijus.

Basically, the reason Kyuubi was tied to Naruto, and the reason he keep having Kyuubi's appearance is that Kyuuubi is the essence of Juubi. It is the same thing that was in the fruit Kaguya ate. This is why Naruto is an exact copy of Rikudo Sennin. You say why? Here is the answer and the only picture in this threads:

You must be registered for see images

According to Mito, Kyuubi is a guardian of the world. This means that the Jinchuriki of Kyuubi will have some kind of power or role to keep the world stable. It suggest that Kyuubi will let someone use his power only if that person is special in the stability of the world.

In fact, just like Rinnegan appears in time of great change, Kyuubi was said to appears when human hatred has reach a certain level.

@Bold, the answer is flashback, he will speak to naruto about his mother of course and the juubi.
 

Misconception

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Can someone sum this up because this is just way to much to read...
 

omarsen

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Naruto is very special bloodline-wise
Why is that? mind to explain? he is half uzumaki half Namikaze, what so special about it?

This makes sense if logic is considered. If placing all the bijus together can cause Rikudo to appear, why did Rikudo not appears in Obito or Madara. Clearly both of them had all the chakra of all the Bijus.

Wrong! Obito didn't even have 8 & 9 tails indside of him, they weren't full bijuu's
Madara had important piece missing, the Yin-Chakra

Naruto is the only one who compeleted the circle with the bijuu's he fist bumped everyone in that dimension, and last thing is the Yin-Kyuubi which he has indside of him now.

Without knowing Rikudo, Naruto has his will
and so Does Hashirama

Naruto is truly Rikudo reincarnated!
No, Naruto is not even close to Rikudo's power nor wisdom, Madara is.

Just like his seal mutate with only Kyuubi's chakra, and he started to grow trees on Zetsus, Naruto will unlock a new power that will turn him into a new Rikudo Sennin
wtf.... That's the Kyuubi's ability, Minato had the same

In fact, just like Rinnegan appears in time of great change, Kyuubi was said to appears when human hatred has reach a certain level.
Kyuubi and the rest of the tailed beasts were always around, Madara was the first one to start using them as weapon, and Hashirama did the same after Madara

Is this what you call bulletproof theory?
 

SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO

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The latest official WSJ preview states that the Mysterious Old Man will entrust something to Naruto, the previous preview states that Naruto will meet a mysterious old man. That is what WSJ says.
 

SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO

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There wouldn't really be a paradox for Naruto to meet Hagoromo even if the former is the reincarnation of the latter for like Minato and Kushina appearing inside Naruto's psyche, it wasn't their actual souls but "Chakra Recordings" they placed in Naruto.
 

NaruSasuRival

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Wow amazing thread impressive, probably the best I have seen today, thumbs up :win:

Now tell me when and where did Mito say Kyuubi was the Guardian of the world? For starters the Kyuubi hates humans... most humans inhabit the world, and surely it doesn't care about the world or humans.

On a serious note what if Naruto has already met Rikudou in the other world as how Kakashi was able to see his father as seeing that he was dead? That would shove your whole theory to the drain

Basically, what Mito means is that Kyuubi's power is a deciding power for the fate of the world. Kyuubi's power must be keep out of the reach of malevolent people. This is why Kyuubi has to keep the world at bay, which also means to keep under surveillance or watch.

This also ties nicely with some other legends that have been linked to Kurama's name.

However, I think your point about a Limbo-like meaning is valid, but it assume that Naruto died while he actually did not. Again, you cannot seal a biju into a dead person. The reason this works is that Naruto is still alive.

Why is that? mind to explain? he is half uzumaki half Namikaze, what so special about it?

First, Uzumaki are very special in terms of bloodline. So far, they have been shown to have the other KKG of the series which is massive life force. Not only they share that with only the best of the Senju Clan, but they also are the vessel or natural host for BIjus. In case you did not see, tree power have been shown to control Bijus: (1) Sharingan, (2) Mokuton, and (3) Sealing techniques. The first 2 are known of children of Rikudo. The last is known of Rikudo himself.

This make the Uzumaki tied to Rikudo's bloodline whther the base like it or not. Until now, they have proven that they have the Senju power - without Mokuton (which obviously comes from Rikudo being Juubikudo). What is remains is to prove that the Uzumaki is also the origin of the Uchia - will be proven when Naruto unlock Rinnegan.


Wrong! Obito didn't even have 8 & 9 tails indside of him, they weren't full bijuu's
Madara had important piece missing, the Yin-Chakra

Naruto is the only one who compeleted the circle with the bijuu's he fist bumped everyone in that dimension, and last thing is the Yin-Kyuubi which he has indside of him now.

Wrong. Obito had a massive piece of whole Kyuubi (YIn and Yang) from both Ginkaku and Kinkaku. Madara has Yang Kurama + Naruto's chakra extracted, which contains both Yin and Yang due to exchange of chakra between the two halves of Kyuubi. If you think Naruto still has chakra of all biju inside him, you have to admit Madara actually add all the chakra. This is because Naruto only have Yin Kurama, piece of 1 and 8 tails, and trace of the rest that remains in his body just like Gaara kept trace of 1 tail after he lost it.

Basically, Madara has more Biju than Naruto along with having Gedo Mazou.

and so Does Hashirama


No, Naruto is not even close to Rikudo's power nor wisdom, Madara is.

Thinking that Madara has wisdom is absurd. Thinking that Madara has Rikudo's power is also a mistake. In case you don't know, Rikudo's power is the absolute power of Narutoverse, and the only person who will attain such absolute power is Naruto.

wtf.... That's the Kyuubi's ability, Minato had the same

Well, I like this. You need to ask yourself who is Minato. First, he is Naruto's father. If you read what Kyuubi said in the chapter where father and son bumped fist, Kyuubi said "After all, they are father and Son". Actually, I keep my bet on, and say that it is a lack of imagination to think Minato is really a random shinobi.

Besides, Minato's seal has not been shown to evolve. Minato is not Uzumaki, and Minato never grow any tree on a Zetsu.

Kyuubi and the rest of the tailed beasts were always around, Madara was the first one to start using them as weapon, and Hashirama did the same after Madara
Are you serious? Did you even read the opening of Naruto? Kyuubi was a legend.
Is this what you call bulletproof theory?

A Question: Why would Naruto meet Rikudo? Why would Naruto look like Rikudo if he is not special? Why can he obtain Rikudo's power as a Jinchuriki when Madara has to reunite the two bloodline before he can achieve that.
 
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Sageflash

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Excellent thread, very fun read. +rep for you
 

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According to Mito, Kyuubi is a guardian of the world. This means that the Jinchuriki of Kyuubi will have some kind of power or role to keep the world stable. It suggest that Kyuubi will let someone use his power only if that person is special in the stability of the world.

No, Mito had never said that. Years ago it was said Kurama consists of hatred, but that is already a revised "fact" from the first databook.
I guess, we shoudn't take all literally.

Basically, what Mito means is that Kyuubi's power is a deciding power for the fate of the world. Kyuubi's power must be keep out of the reach of malevolent people. This is why Kyuubi has to keep the world at bay, which also means to keep under surveillance or watch.

Actually, Mitos term means something like: keep the world at arm's length. It's the only logical choice, if we consider the whole context of that scene, hm?
 
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NaruSasuRival

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No, Mito had never said that. Years ago it was said Kurama consists of hatred, but that is already a revised "fact" from the first databook.
I guess, we shoudn't take all literally.



Actually, Mitos term means something like: keep the world at arm's length. It's the only logical choice, if we consider the whole context of that scene, hm?

Why would you keep the world at arm length in the first place? The literal meaning fof keeping the world at bay is to keep a safe distance between them - that is Kurama has to keep a safe distance between him and the world (or human being).

Well, seeing as you already want Sasuke to meet also someone, I can understand you cannot accept what I said about Naruto.
 

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Awesome read! It has been state and is obvious that Naruto is the next Sage but I still they need to meet each other, he needs to meet his successor to know for certain his super plan worked out in the end. Where does all this leave the Jubi? Forever in Naruto? Simply disappears due to lack of hatred?
 

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Great theory and respect for all amazing efforts put to create such well constructed and detailed theory ;)

However I disagree and believe Sage will appear to reveal his backstory, reveal key to beat Juubi or even Juubi's weakness, maybe gives Naruto's his power or at least train him/ give him knowledge.

I believe requirements to trigger Sage's appearing are following:

- possesing even a bit of EACH tailed beasts chakra(Sage wanted tailed beasts to be equally needed, so all of them not just one could be enough)

- need of getting admiration from Tailed beasts by revealing to choosen one their names which play as key to awake/trigger Sage's chakra divided into nine parts and sealed into each Tailed beasts to emerge from tailed beasts chakra then merge together to forms kind of chakra avatar/imprint/ghost of Sage as last possibility of saving world from evil and only one time appearance.
 
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