[Fear] Truth behind the FTG (Flying Death God)

[FearxDeath]

[Fear] Truth behind the FTG (Flying Thunder God)[Updated]

[Before you post something claiming that I am wrong I ask that you provide some actual proof of it, it could be a link to a different site, a thread or even a scan, just dont post some nonsense telling me to go on a wild goose chase to find the contradicting proof you believe is out there somewhere.]

UPDATED As of 10:47PM - 3/18/2013
(Answered a good question in the response section)

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It is my firm belief that the FTG[

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] otherwise known as the Flying ThunderGod Technique is a Kekie Genkia requiring both Lightning style[

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] and the Wind style[

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]. The premise behind this is that

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.



Lightning Reference in Jutsu Name

• The Flying Thunder God technique otherwise known as the Flying Raijin Technique goes by another name in romji, that is Hiraishin no Jutsu. In romji the word Hiraishin translates to mean "Lightning Rod[
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  ]", this speaks to the fact that the technique requires seals as a form of Lightning rod attracting the "Lightning ".
• The fact that Minato was infact known as the "Yellow Flash", yellow flashes are also characteristics of Lightning and in many cases if you look up an image of a thunder bolt it will often be yellow. This is yet another Lightning style undertone.
• The other part of the name is "Flying" this to me references the fact that the jutsu requires Wind Style as well

Mythology

In the Japanese Folklore the Raijin (The Thunder God) is always accompanied with the Fujin, take a wild guess at what the Fujin is.. Thats right, the Wind God.

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Kishimoto is known for making parrallels between the Narutoverse and japanese folklore with some of his favorites being in jutsu, for instance.

• Izangi and Izanami are Japanese Gods envolved in an epic tragedy.
• In the tragedy Izanami is Izangi's Wife who ends up dying giving birth, Izangi goes to the underworld to bring her back but she cannot go with him, she then makes him promise not to look at her which he breaks by Lightning up a fire and looking at her, it is then that she chases after him and he escapes the underworld. As he leaves she says that she will kill 1000 people everyday to which he responds then 1,500 will be born everyday. In Naruto Izanami is Izangi's counter part and where one lets you escape your destiny and avoid death the other choses it for you granted you fulfill a certain condition.
• Tsukuyomi, Amaterasu and Susan'o are the 3 Demi-God created by Izangi as he cleans himself after leaving the underworld.
• Tsukuyomi the God of the moon was created when he washed his left eye, Susan'o the god of the storms was created when he washed his nose and Amaterasu the goddess of the Sun was created when he washed his right eye.
• Totsuka is the sword Izangi uses to kill the child that Izanami bore during her pregnancy. It was afterwards passed down to Susan'o.

As you can see Kishimoto loves to make these parallels between the manga and kapanese lore and this is something people should take note of, So the question is when creating a technique that pays homage to the Thunder God (So much as to be named after him), Why would he neglect to also pay homage to his counter part the Wind God?



How the Jutsu Works

Minato starts the Jutsu by covering himself with Wind Chakra, much like the how Asuma incases his Brass Knuckles with Wind Chakra. He then Super Charges the Wind Chakra surrounding him with Lightning Style which compresses him reducing his body to a stream of Light (Which moves at 186,000 miles per second) which is then draw to whichever seal, like a Lightning rod,[

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] he was focusing on prior to using the technique, once it arrives it his body then materializes instantly.


Reasoning behind Hokage Guards supposed incompetance

Here are some inconsistencies you would find if my Theory was incorrect

• Another good reason for why my Theory works is because it explains why the "Hokage Guard[
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  ]" are not able to use the Jutsu individually. Minato was not regarded for having an extraordinarily large amount of Chakra and even at that he spams FTG so much that one would believe that even if it did require alot of chakra the average ninja would be able to use it at least once.
  
• What could possibly be the reason why a highly skilled ninja would not be able to use it, Genma Shiranui[
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  ] alone was a skilled ninja. Here are his stats from the DataBook[
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  ]:
  
  
  
  Ninjutsu-Taijutsu-Genjutsu-Intelligence-Strength-Speed-Stamina-Hand seals-Total
  4.5-----------3----------3-----------3-----------3--------3.5------3----------4--------27​
  
  Keep in mind that Hokage level Ninja max out at around 33-35 Total points. So why would a technique that a person with 33-35 Total points can use require 3 Ninja that are 27-30 Total points? Simple, Seperatatly they do not have the required Chakra Natures, but together they form a "MakeShift" Wind/Lightning Kekie Genkia user. And by coming together[
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  ] they can use a kekkie genkia that would normally require a single person possessing different Chakra Natures. Much like how Naruto uses his Rasengan, Normally the Rasengan would require one person to mix and gather the chakra in there hands. But Naruto bypasses that by using a clone and splitting the job into two different tasks. With that it is also possible that with 1 Lightning style user, 1 wind style user, and 1 person that molds the chakra a group of skilled ninja would be able to use a jutsu that would require 1 person to do all of that at the same time.

Response to Comments

Thats where your Logic failed, kekkei genkkei is a bloodline limit. You cant just perform a kekkei genkkei by combining chakra natures-.-! Nice try...

1) You infer that the bloodline limit can only be passed on by blood and thus cannot be used outside of that condition. But the Jinchuriki's lava style and steam release are blood line limits that are not passed on by blood and with that your premise is gone. Secondly here is a qoute from the wiki "...Other kekkei genkai include mixing one type of elemental chakra with another, creating a new one unique to the users, which is usually impossible for normal ninja.[

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]" Here it clearly states that it is usually impossible, which itself hints towards an exceptions to the rule.

2) A good example of how bloodline limits worked would be a ninja's first chakra type. Much like kakshi showed with the special paper that would shrivel, get damp, turn to ashe, be sliced in half or turn to dirt depending on a ninja primary chakra type. This primary chakra type is what would come naturally to said ninja with additional chakra types being harder to master than the original, but not impossible, because chakra is chakra and it all depends on how you mold it. The kekkia genkia user has more than 1 natural chakra type, or so goes my theory, and thus they have an easier time mastering said kekkia genkia, but it is not impossible for others to master it as well, because again, chakra is chakra.

In the slide

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Kakashi explains how jutsu's work, it begins with the mixing of spiritual and physical energies into the body to create chakra and the type of chakra used will reflect on the jutsu. All i would propose would be a 3rd artificial mixing done by the hokage guard which would merge the 2 types of chakra's.
​

No, its space time ninjutsu that doesn't involve lightning and wind. That's like saying you need element to perform the summoning tech -____-

First i want to dismiss this notion that the space-time jutsu's are their own magical jutsu, Space-Time jutsu and the usage of the word is more like ninjutsu or genjutsu. It is just a broad term used to describe jutsu that alter Space and Time. The term is not mutually exclusive.

I find it extremely hard to say that his Space-Time ninjutsu has no techs, In reference to the S-T Jutsu itself there are several different ways to make use of Space-Time Jutsu and everyone who uses it employs it in different ways. I believe that Minato uses the kekkie Genkia to employ S-T Jutsu. And so when you say "It is a S-T Ninjutsu that doesnt involve Lightning and wind" it is weird because the fact that it is an S-T Jutsu doesnt exclude the fact that it could also be a kekkie genkia.

You end by pairing S-T Jutsu's with Summoning Jutsu's, making Summonings the standard to which S-T Jutsu's are held to. And thus you say that S-T Jutsu's cannot require techs because Summonings do not require techs, but Summonings do require seals, we know that kamui is a type of S-T Jutsu and we know that Kamui does not require seals. What this shows is that S-T Jutsu come in different forms and sizes and just because one may not employ techs that does not mean the other cannot. That added with my above stated inconsistencies created if my theory is wrong we are left with a higher probability of me being right than wrong, and for you to say otherwise you will need to address my proposed inconsistencies .​

1. It's FTG (Flying ThunderGod). Idk how you can mess that up.
2. I'm going to stick with the assumption that it's a reverse summon.

Good try.

You are then left addressing why Minato could use the technique while it requires 3 highly skilled ninja (The Hokages Gaurd, so we know there not pushovers) to replicate the technique. Minato was not especially blessed as far as having an enourmous chakra pool and summoning/reverse summoning is fairly uncomplicated since almost every ninja can do it with relative ease.
​

Conclusion

The FTG is a kekkie genkia technique, much like hashirama's wood style jutsu, requiring someone to have both Lightning and wind style.

 

[Pumpkin Ninja]

Nice thread. I have to agree with this.

 

[Tebows Youth Group]

Very, very cool explanation, I really enjoyed the read. The explanation of how it is basically Wind condensed with chakra is a super creative idea. Great thread....

 

[Sage OfThe 6 Paths]

WOOOW THAAT EXPLAINS EVERYTHING major rep

 

[Yusuke Urameshi]

1. It's FTG (Flying ThunderGod). Idk how you can mess that up.
2. I'm going to stick with the assumption that it's a reverse summon.

Good try.

 

[FearxDeath]

1. It's FTG (Flying ThunderGod). Idk how you can mess that up.
2. I'm going to stick with the assumption that it's a reverse summon.

Good try.

The only problem with that Theory is that you cannot Summon yourself, because you cannot form a contract with yourself. So that theory doesnt explain how he uses the jutsu on himself. Or how he resummons himself somewhere else.

On top of that isnt blood required for summong? Yet he does this summoning without blood?

 

[BigBlade Master]

1. It's ftg (flying thundergod). Idk how you can mess that up.
2. I'm going to stick with the assumption that it's a reverse summon.

Good try.

i agree with this.

 

[~Uzumaki~]

No, its space time ninjutsu that doesn't involve lightning and wind. That's like saying you need element to perform the summoning tech -____-

 

[~Uzumaki~]

It is my firm belief that the FTG[

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] otherwise known as the Flying ThunderGod Technique is a Kekie Genkia requiring both Lighting style[

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] and the Wind style[

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]. The premise behind this is that Minato was infact a Lighting style user.



Lighting Reference in Jutsu Name

• First and foremost all defining factors of the technique revolve around lighting. The name itself gives homage to the lighting style but also the romji translation of the word. And in the series I have seen very little if any jutsu's that do not reference the style requiring the jutsu in its name.
  
  The Flying Thunder God technique otherwise known as the Flying Raijin Technique goes by another name in romji, that is Hiraishin no Jutsu. In romji the word Hiraishin translates to mean "Lighting Rod[
  You must be registered for see links
  ]", this speaks to the fact that the technique requires seals as a form of lighting rod attracting the "Lighting".
• The fact that Minato was infact known as the "Yellow Flash", yellow flashes are also characteristics of lighting and in many cases if you look up an image of a thunder bolt it will often be yellow, much like the logo The Flash wears on his chest. This is yet another lighting style undertone.
• The other part of the name is "Flying" this to me references the fact that the jutsu requires Wind Style as well

Mythology

In the Japanese Folklore the Raijin (The Thunder God) is always accompanied with the Fujin, take a wild guess at what the Fujin is.. Thats right, the Wind God.

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Kishimoto alway even portrays the Thunder and Lightining Gods in the series a Second time in the characters of Raijin and Fujin the Incredibly Stupid Brothers. Who too are always together.

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The parallel Kishimoto makes between Thunder and Lighting is one people should take note of, So the question is when creating a technique that pay complete homage to the Thunder God, Why would he neglect to also pay homage to his lesser counter part the Wind God.



How the Jutsu Works

Mnato starts the Jutsu by covering himself with Wind Chakra, much like the how Asuma incases his Brass Knuckles with Wind Chakra. He then Super Charges the Wind Chakra surrounding him with Lighting Style which compresses him reducing his body to a stream of lighting which is then draw to which ever seal, like a lighting rod[

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] he was focusing on prior to using the technique, once it arrives it his body then materializes instantly.


Reasoning behind Hokage Guards supposed incompetance

Here are some inconsistencies you would find if my Theory was incorrect

• Another good reason for why my Theory works is because it explains why the "Hokage Guard[
  You must be registered for see links
  ]" are not able to use the Jutsu individually. Minato was not regarded for having an extraordinarily large amount of Chakra and even at that he spams FTG so much that one would believe that even if it did require alot of chakra the average ninja would be able to use it at least once.
  
• What could possibly be the reason why a highly skilled ninja would not be able to use it, Genma Shiranui[
  You must be registered for see links
  ] alone was a skilled ninja. Here are his stats from the DataBook[
  You must be registered for see links
  ]:
  
  
  
  Ninjutsu-Taijutsu-Genjutsu-Intelligence-Strength-Speed-Stamina-Hand seals-Total
  4.5-----------3----------3-----------3-----------3--------3.5------3----------4--------27​
  
  Keep in mind that Hokage level Ninja max out at around 33-35 Total points. So why would a technique that a person with 33-35 Total points can use require 3 Ninja that are 27-30 Total points? Simple, Seperatatly they do not have the required Chakra Natures, but together they form a "MakeShift" Wind/Lighting Kekie Genkia user. And by coming together[
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  ] and using there seperate techniques in cohesion they can use a technique that would normally require a single person with each seperate technique. Much like how Naruto uses his Rasengan, Normally the Rasengan would require one person to mix and gather the chakra in there hands. But Naruto bypasses the fact that he needs to focus on doing both at the same time by using a clone and splitting the job into two different tasks. With that mentality, 1 lighting style user, 1 wind style user, and 1 person that gathers the chakra could in fact use a jutsu that would require 1 person to do all of that at the same time.

Response to Comments

I find it extremely hard to say that his Space-Time ninjutsu has no techs, In reference to the S-T Jutsu itself there are several different ways to make use of Space-Time Jutsu and everyone who uses it employs it in different ways. I believe that Minato uses the kekkie Genkia to employ S-T Jutsu. And so when you say "It is a S-T Ninjutsu that doesnt involve lighting and wind" it is weird because the fact that it is an S-T Jutsu doesnt exclude the fact that it could also be a kekkie genkia.

You end by pairing S-T Jutsu's with Summoning Jutsu's, making Summonings the standard to which S-T Jutsu's are held to. And thus you say that S-T Jutsu's cannot require techs because Summonings do not require techs, but Summonings do require seals, we know that kamui is a type of S-T Jutsu and we know that Kamui does not require seals. What this shows is that S-T Jutsu come in different forms and sizes and just because one may not employ techs that does not mean the other cannot. That added with my above stated inconsistencies created if my theory is wrong we are left with a higher probability of me being right than wrong, and for you to say otherwise you will need to address my proposed inconsistencies .​

You are then left addressing why Minato could use the technique while it requires 3 highly skilled ninja (The Hokages Gaurd, so we know there not pushovers) to replicate the technique. Mnato was not especially blessed as far as having an enourmous chakra pool and summoning/reverse summoning is fairly uncomplicated since almost every ninja can do it with relative ease.
​

Conclusion

The FTG is a kekkie genkia technique, much like hashirama's wood style jutsu, requiring someone to have both lighting and wind style.

Oh my God, you utterly convinced. I can't believe I was so blind before. I guess it had something to do with all those databook entries suggesting otherwise, and the fact that nobody ever mentioned it. I'm Kishi was just high or something. YOU'RE the one's that's correct U_U

 

[FearxDeath]

Oh my God, you utterly convinced. I can't believe I was so blind before. I guess it had something to do with all those databook entries suggesting otherwise, and the fact that nobody ever mentioned it. I'm Kishi was just high or something. YOU'RE the one's that's correct U_U

Good job quoting the entire post. You made a statement, I addressed the statement. Rather than building a rhetoric you post that non sense. Good job, But i will humor you, can you post a few of the numerous databook entries that suggest otherwise?

 

[YellowFlash1]

The only problem with that Theory is that you cannot Summon yourself, because you cannot form a contract with yourself. So that theory doesnt explain how he uses the jutsu on himself. Or how he resummons himself somewhere else.

On top of that isnt blood required for summong? Yet he does this summoning without blood?

Well actually you can.

Spoiler

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That doesn't mean to say that you hypothesis was wrong. I enjoyed the read, keep up the good work!

 

[~Uzumaki~]

Good job quoting the entire post. You made a statement, I addressed the statement. Rather than building a rhetoric you post that non sense. Good job, But i will humor you, can you post a few of the numerous databook entries that suggest otherwise?

Crap, I've lost my databook links, I must have left them at a friend's space >_>. Just search Flying Thunder God technique on narutopedia and you'd get the full gist.

A few questions which basically destroys your entire post-if FTG is a kekkei genkai, how come Minato taught it to the guards? Are you suggesting that the Yellow Flash was so dimwitted that he didn't realize kekkei genkai are passed on by blood? Or is FTG to only supposed kekkei genkai that can simply be taught to a group of folk?

Why didn't Kishi mention it....ever?

 

[AGoodBoy]

I was thinking they exact same thing that is was a kekei genkai and that's why those 3 jonins needed to be together to use it. They probably had to manipulate wind and lightning properly between themselves. First person adds wind, second adds lightning, and third acts as a container to blend as close as possible into the kekei genkai...


Hanev't read OP yet though. Just conclusion. tl;dr lol

 

[AGoodBoy]

No, its space time ninjutsu that doesn't involve lightning and wind. That's like saying you need element to perform the summoning tech -____-

what do you mean? Space time just means it manipulates space and time. Why call it wind lightning? They don't say earth-fire or water-earth. they say lava and wood

 

[FearxDeath]

Crap, I've lost my databook links, I must have left them at a friend's space >_>. Just search Flying Thunder God technique on narutopedia and you'd get the full gist.

A few questions which basically destroys your entire post-if FTG is a kekkei genkai, how come Minato taught it to the guards? Are you suggesting that the Yellow Flash was so dimwitted that he didn't realize kekkei genkai are passed on by blood? Or is FTG to only supposed kekkei genkai that can simply be taught to a group of folk?

Why didn't Kishi mention it....ever?

Lol, I address this in my thread. If you had read it you would already know my answer to this.... its a shame how comfortable you are with being this ignorant. You didnt even have the decency to read the entire post before you began bad mouthing it...

 

[FearxDeath]

what do you mean? Space time just means it manipulates space and time. Why call it wind lightning? They don't say earth-fire or water-earth. they say lava and wood

^ This guy gets its... You would think you wouldnt have to explain something so uncomplicated and obvious right?

 

[AGoodBoy]

^ This guy gets its... You would think you wouldnt have to explain something so uncomplicated and obvious right?

A lot of people aren't that old/open minded on here

 

[spike2068]

I like you theory the only problem I have is that if it is a kekkei genkai and 3 of the guards can achieve it by working together then any kekkei genkai that is chakra nature based (pretty much everything but doujutsu) should be able to be mimicked. So meis boil release tech should be able to be mimicked as well if you had a few people working together. But if we look at it from that standpoint I think it all works.

 

[FearxDeath]

I like you theory the only problem I have is that if it is a kekkei genkai and 3 of the guards can achieve it by working together then any kekkei genkai that is chakra nature based (pretty much everything but doujutsu) should be able to be mimicked. So meis boil release tech should be able to be mimicked as well if you had a few people working together. But if we look at it from that standpoint I think it all works.

Thanks im glad your liked the post, I can see how the idea of any group of people being able to replicate any kekkie genkia as being something someone wouldnt want to believe but keep in mind that it is harder for a group of people to make use of a jutsu than it would be for one person and they would more than likely only be able to use the technique to a certain extent. Just like the Hokage Squad can only teleport certain sized items while minato was able to teleport an entire tailed beast bomb. Also they must keep there fingers connected and cant use it in rapid successions, it is the limitations of using this technique as a group that makes it less viable as an offensive technique and more of a niche thing done for the ease of transportation.

I could go on and on about the disadvantages of a group of people using a jutsu when compared to a single person but I think you get the point. It works for FTG because teleportation is a heck of a convenience, I dont see the sand village training a group of ninja for years on end just so they could use jinton to lift heavy equipment.

 

[Lost Woods Denizen]

I read your thread, and I do believe that you thought this theory out very well. However, I think that this may be an instance of over examination. After we were informed about the possibility to mix different chakra natures to create a unique nature, we were introduced to many different elemental kekkei genkai. I think that one of the most important aspects of a kekkei genkai is that it cannot be mimicked, only stolen. I do not believe that Kisame and the Onoki working together could manipulate wood release, nor do I believe that Naruto and Yamato collaborating could create ice release. As Yamato explained, elemental kekkei genkai are not simply Element "A" plus Element "B," but rather a mixture of the elements creating a completely new chakra for said nature. In other words, the two chakra are mixed internally, resulting in a chakra that is different from either of its individual parts. If the flying thunder god was indeed a kekkei genkai, then it should not be replicable, even by capable jonin.

I agree with you when you say that Kishimoto uses a lot of mythology in his manga, from names of characters to the names of jutsu. However, what he also uses when he write the manga is phonetical puns. He gives a jutsu a name that has the sound of another word, but it's individual kanji are different, giving it another meaning. This is seen in Darui and A's attacks, Kitsuchi's attack, and in relation to this thread, Minato's flying thunder god. The mechanics of the flying thunder god's is like that of a lightning rod (which is also read as hiraishin) in that Minato has a seal placed somewhere, and its to that seal that he is "attracted." You said the same thing, but explained that his body is compressed into lightning and then attracted to the seal. That would mean that he is traveling in a relatively direct manner, from point A directly to point B, as opposed to how we have seen him actually move. If Minato was lightning moving to the seal, then how would we explain him teleporting from an outside area to an inside area without damaging the surrounding. From what we have seen, he simply appears, which is very reminiscent of all space-time ninjutsu shown thus far. Your theory would be adding another step that does not seem consistent across all areas of usage.

Lastly, you took an interesting approach by providing your own assumption of the combination of elements it takes to create the kekkei genkai of the hiraishin. From what I have seen with elemental kekkei genkai, there is no need for a medium to use them (in your case, the seal of the flying thunder god.) The user can simply use it. And there is no reason to believe that, instead of lightning and wind creating the hiraishin, it makes the magnet release. The same evidence can be used (magnet release users were only shown to be from the sand and cloud villages, so maybe the combination of wind and lightning creates jinton? This is a theory to be pursued another day.)

I am not here to say that your theory is incorrect, because we do not know that. However, what we have been told is that (1) the flying thunder god is a space-time ninjutsu (2) kekkei genkai cannot be copied or replicated without having said kekkei genkai. These two statements conflict with your theory. I believe that you are focusing too specifically on the "raiSHIN" part of the name of the jutsu (the name of the god was RaiJIN, but Kishimoto specifically used the raiSHIN way of naming it) and not enough on the technique name as a whole. At this point in the manga, it would be too forced to give Minato a kekkei genkai, after establishing him as a "hard working genius" not endowed with a genetic superiority. I believe that my opinion is better supported by the manga.